Do multiple caster level bonuses stack?

[TessarrianDM]

If a character gains multiple bonuses to caster level (for example, has the Practiced Spellcaster and Arcane Thesis feats), would they stack? As a specific example, if a Cleric 3/Wizard 3 /Mystic Theurge 9 has those two feats, would he cast his thesis spell as a Wizard 17 or Wiz 15?

 

[Krensus]

I believe that multiple bonuses to caster levels do stack, though I could be mistaken. As long as they are only labeled as "bonuses" and not "enhancement bonus," "competence bonus," etc., they stack. I know that the caster level increases from Master Specialist stack, as do the increases from Archmage if you choose that as High Arcana multiple times.

If I'm wrong, someone feel free to correct me.

 

[irdeggman]

In this case they should stack.

Practised Spellcaster is limited by your hit dice (with a maximum of +4 levels)

Arcane Thesis is limited to a single spell.

So he would cast wizard spells as a 15th level but for the wizard spell associated with Arcane Thesis it would be 17th level.

Note this is assuming that you are applying Practised Spellcaster to your wizard casting levels - it only applies to a single class (to increase) - so one feat for wizard and another for cleric.

 

[TessarrianDM]

In this case they should stack.

Practised Spellcaster is limited by your hit dice (with a maximum of +4 levels)

Arcane Thesis is limited to a single spell.

So he would cast wizard spells as a 15th level but for the wizard spell associated with Arcane Thesis it would be 17th level.

Note this is assuming that you are applying Practised Spellcaster to your wizard casting levels - it only applies to a single class (to increase) - so one feat for wizard and another for cleric.

He has taken Practiced Spellcaster in both classes.

Would you reach the same conclusion if the caster levels applied to more than one spell? Say, for instance, if a domain gave you +1 caster level to a class of spell (such as healing, good, etc.)? What if the Arcane Thesis spell has that descriptor (say, this character choosing Summon Monster III, having the Good domain, and summoning a good creature)?

Can you think of any case where it should not stack? I have been allowing it to stack in all cases, since it is not a "named bonus"; I just want to make sure that I am not giving more power to this character than he should have.

 

[Herzog]

The only restriction I can think of is that bonusses from the same source do not stack, unless the source specifically states otherwise.

Most of the time, that is included in the description of the source (you can take this feat multiple times. it's effect doesn't stack. instead, you apply the bonus to a different <thing> each time you select this feat)

Should you, somehow, get an effect multiple times (a domain + some kind of item granting you bonusses of that domain) the effects don't stack.

Herzog

 

[irdeggman]

He has taken Practiced Spellcaster in both classes.

Would you reach the same conclusion if the caster levels applied to more than one spell? Say, for instance, if a domain gave you +1 caster level to a class of spell (such as healing, good, etc.)? What if the Arcane Thesis spell has that descriptor (say, this character choosing Summon Monster III, having the Good domain, and summoning a good creature)?

Can you think of any case where it should not stack? I have been allowing it to stack in all cases, since it is not a "named bonus"; I just want to make sure that I am not giving more power to this character than he should have.

Pretty much it depends on the exact wording of the feat/ability that grants the increase.

If they have text like practiced spellcaster where you are limited by HD - then I would apply that limit as a total, but in general - unless there is something to state otherwise they should stack.

Just to make sure - neither of these feats grants more spells or access to higher level spells (only for spell effects).

 

[TessarrianDM]

Just to make sure - neither of these feats grants more spells or access to higher level spells (only for spell effects).

Right. It has a direct impact on the combat we are in the middle of, where he is tossing medium- and long-range spells from near maximum range. The extra 20'-80' of distance can make a difference in the targets he can affect.

It also affects caster level checks, such as those for greater dispel magic and spell penetration, both of which have played important parts in previous fights.

 

[Hypersmurf]

If they have text like practiced spellcaster where you are limited by HD - then I would apply that limit as a total, but in general - unless there is something to state otherwise they should stack.

The principle they seem to use is that the limited increase should be applied at the most advantageous step - that is, after penalties, but before other bonuses.

Let's say I'm a Clr3/Ftr2 with Practised Spellcaster and an Orange Ioun Stone.

My base caster level is 3; Practised Spellcaster adds up to +4, capped at my hit dice, so it raises my caster level to 5; then the stone gives a +1 bonus for a total of 6.

I take a negative level, and incur a -1 penalty to caster level. The penalty is applied to my base caster level: 3 - 1 = 2. Then PS adds up to +4, capped at hit dice - bringing the total to 5. And the stone gives +1, so my total is still 6.

-Hyp.

 

[irdeggman]

The principle they seem to use is that the limited increase should be applied at the most advantageous step - that is, after penalties, but before other bonuses.

Let's say I'm a Clr3/Ftr2 with Practised Spellcaster and an Orange Ioun Stone.

My base caster level is 3; Practised Spellcaster adds up to +4, capped at my hit dice, so it raises my caster level to 5; then the stone gives a +1 bonus for a total of 6.

I take a negative level, and incur a -1 penalty to caster level. The penalty is applied to my base caster level: 3 - 1 = 2. Then PS adds up to +4, capped at hit dice - bringing the total to 5. And the stone gives +1, so my total is still 6.

-Hyp.

When I said "in total" what I meant was that if there were two different feats that granted +4 to Cl up to HD. Then instead of applying that twice (as in +4 and another +4) I would limit it to +4 (up to HD). That is what I meant. Two feats with the same limiting text should not stack, IMO. But like you point out if they do not contain that kind of limit then they should stack in the most advantageous manner.

 

[Set]

Consumptive Field, Domains (Chaos, Good, Evil, Law, Gnome, Healing, Illusion, etc), Death Knell, Orange Ioun Stones, Practiced Spellcaster, all pretty much stack with each other, but multiple instances of the same effect (such as six Orange Ioun Stones or multiple castings of Death Knell in rapid succession) wouldn't stack with themselves.