Dragon Heist as a prologue for Ravenloft?

[robus]

I havent dabbled in home brewing but I may make that my first attempt at it if I cant find anything anyone else has done. Thanks for the suggestions!

I’m pushing for it mostly because I think Dragon Heist is not a good adventure as the whole thing is a hit of a mess and the ending is a let down (spoiler: there’s no heist) (note: not run it, this is from imagining running it, so take that for what it’s worth...) but it’s also not a combat heavy adventure and you mentioned your players like fighting things.

 

[MockingBird]

That's why I am hesitant. The last time I ran a noncombat heavy adventure they didnt seem to enjoy it. I'm not entirely sure if it was the lack of combat or my lack of skill in running an intrigue type adventure. I do know they have enjoyed Lost Mines and currently Tomb of Annihilation. Either way I'm gonna buy it even if just to read and have some lore for Waterdeep.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Following on from a something I said in another thread, the upcoming Ghosts of Saltmarsh might make a tonally more appropriate prequal to Curse of Strahd. Or download the U1 pdf.

If you want to go with the old Ravenloft campaign setting lore, Saltmarsh could be a town that is gradually being drawn into the mists over the course of the adventure.

 

[ccs]

Having prior knowledge of Ravenloft when starting the campaign really waters down the experience. The players are meant to feel trapped and hopeless and a place where survival is hard.

I have never seen this actually occur. Frustration, anger, & annoyance - yes. Trapped & hopeless? No.

* I've seen plenty of players 2e+ who weren't happy because they thought they were going to get screwed over rules-wise. (even when directly told those rules weren't being used)
* And I've seen plenty of Ravenloft games where players didn't know anything about the setting get screwed with ruleswise & were mad about it.
* I've seen plenty of players quit Loft games to avoid rules screws or just refuse to play anything with that masthead.
* I've also seen plenty of 2e/3x vets assume that the old rules dickery applies today.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

That's a valid point. I don't think it's fair for the mighty heroic adventurers to wander into some mist one day and now they are screwed over. Players want to know what kind of campaign they are committing too. If everyone likes horror and is happy to join a horror themed campaign from the start that's fine, but many players are likely to view it being sprung upon them as unfair.

 

[GlassJaw]

That's a valid point. I don't think it's fair for the mighty heroic adventurers to wander into some mist one day and now they are screwed over. Players want to know what kind of campaign they are committing too. If everyone likes horror and is happy to join a horror themed campaign from the start that's fine, but many players are likely to view it being sprung upon them as unfair.

I would certainly check with the players what type of campaign they are looking for. That said, it's easy enough to describe the campaign as dark or even survival horror. However, I would avoid saying "Ravenloft" at all costs.

Again, one of the core tenets of the setting is getting pulled from the familiar into the unknown. It's a way to change the motivation from kill the bad guys and take their stuff to survival and escape. That's normally hard to do in a "standard" D&D campaign.

You'll also note that none of the adventure hooks in CoS have the players as native to Barovia.

 

[GlassJaw]

I have never seen this actually occur. Frustration, anger, & annoyance - yes. Trapped & hopeless? No.

* I've seen plenty of players 2e+ who weren't happy because they thought they were going to get screwed over rules-wise. (even when directly told those rules weren't being used)
* And I've seen plenty of Ravenloft games where players didn't know anything about the setting get screwed with ruleswise & were mad about it.
* I've seen plenty of players quit Loft games to avoid rules screws or just refuse to play anything with that masthead.
* I've also seen plenty of 2e/3x vets assume that the old rules dickery applies today.

Ravenloft has nothing to do with the "rules". It's all about mood and emotion. Gothic horror requires the stakes to be raised. The unknown is scary. That's what evokes those emotions.

I do agree that if your players are powergaming crybabies, Ravenloft isn't for them. It's certainly not a campaign for every group.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Jonathan Harker isn't native to Transylvania, but he is native to the world that Transylvania is in, and natives of Transylvania can travel to Jonathan Harker's native land.

You know what is more scary than being trapped in a dark world? Knowing that world is all there is, and there isn't anywhere else to escape too.

I wouldn't consider Ravenloft as "survival" horror, either. That is a rather new sub-genre that owes it's existence to computer games.

 

[Gradine]

I wouldn't consider Ravenloft as "survival" horror, either. That is a rather new sub-genre that owes it's existence to computer games.

I think the comparison is apt though. Ravenloft has many of the prominent features you'd find in survival horror video games:
*Closed Circle - Escape is either impossible or very non-trivial, and figuring out how to escape can be as difficult as the escaping.
*Limited Resources - Survival horror games rely on limiting your resources (ammo, healing items, etc.) to amp up the suspense and dread; Ravenloft is similarly resource-starved.
*Hostile Environment - Nearly everything is trying to kill you, and the things that aren't are incredibly unsettling and/or untrustworthy.
*Combat De-Emphasized - Ravenloft tends to feed murderhobo parties into the meatgrinder. This can vary more or less depending on adventure, DM, or location, but typically the monsters are more powerful than the party and they have to use their wits more than their brawn to resolve situations.

 

[GlassJaw]

I think the comparison is apt though. Ravenloft has many of the prominent features you'd find in survival horror video games:
*Closed Circle - Escape is either impossible or very non-trivial, and figuring out how to escape can be as difficult as the escaping.
*Limited Resources - Survival horror games rely on limiting your resources (ammo, healing items, etc.) to amp up the suspense and dread; Ravenloft is similarly resource-starved.
*Hostile Environment - Nearly everything is trying to kill you, and the things that aren't are incredibly unsettling and/or untrustworthy.
*Combat De-Emphasized - Ravenloft tends to feed murderhobo parties into the meatgrinder. This can vary more or less depending on adventure, DM, or location, but typically the monsters are more powerful than the party and they have to use their wits more than their brawn to resolve situations.

This. "Survival horror" is about the mood and emotion that is evoked. It's about constant fighting and hacking through swarms of enemies (although that may occur at times). For example, in The Walking Dead, the zombies apocalypse is the catalyst for the characters to exist and make choices.

In addition, the zombie apocalypse outbreak was sudden and brutal. It sets the stage for the characters to then have to adjust in an extremely frightening and foreign world where nothing is guaranteed.