Eldritch Trickster = Warlock and Rogue with a dash of Trickster

[BartD]

I have a player who wants to multiclass his rogue into warlock and the later take arcane trickster levels. I'm fine with that and will make it possible to enter the AT prc as a R3/W4.
However, I'm considering offering a more smooth progression instead, which will give the special abilities which we find the most interesting. As for the power level, I have aimed for about level 14-15 of each class since that's about where you'd get using arcane trickster.

I think the class is pretty good, but what do you think? Is it too much or too spread out to be useful?
(and no, the hellfire warlock -or whatever it's called- will not be available)

Eldritch Trickster

HD, BAB, proficiencies: As rogue. Saves: As bard.
Skill points: 6 + intelligence modifier.
Class skills: As rogue plus Concentration, Knowledge (arcana, planes), Spellcraft.
Special abilities (level 11, 14, 17, 20): As rogue plus may take Extra Invocation and Imbue Item (from level 14).

[B]Level	SneakA	E.Blast	Invoc	Specials[/B]	
1	1d6			Trapfinding
2		1d6	Least	Detect magic
3				Evasion
4	2d6		2	DR 1/cold iron
5		2d6		Uncanny dodge
6			3	Deceive item
7	3d6			Fiendish Resilience 1
8		3d6	Lesser	Improved Uncanny Dodge
9				Impromptu Sneak Attack 1/day
10	4d6		5	DR 3/cold iron
11		4d6		Special ability
12			6	Impromptu Sneak Attack 2/day
13	5d6			Fiendish Resilience 3
14		5d6	Greater	Special ability
15				Impromptu Sneak Attack 3/day
16	6d6		8	DR 5/cold iron
17		6d6		Special ability
18			9	Impromptu Sneak Attack 4/day
19	7d6			Fiendish Resilience 5
20	 	7d6	Dark	Special ability

 

[Nifft]

I like it a lot.

It's a bit clumpy, a few things could be cut, but overall a really good job.

IMHO, E.Blast should come before Sneak Attack. It's going to be his primary attack form, yes? You could just swap the progressions and everything would be okay.

Also, I hate Impromptu Sneak Attack. It always felt like a filler ability even for the Arcane Trickster, but the Warlock-inspired dude has even less use for a 1/day ability.

IMHO: Level 1 should give him EB 1d6, Trapfinding and detect magic.
Level 2 giving SA +1d6 and his first Least invocation is nice.
Evasion is right on target.

At higher levels, he's getting a bit too much. IMHO, you could drop Fiendish Resilience and Impromptu SA, push back his DR/Cold Iron (because that's a really good ability), and have a few levels where he "only" gets goodies in the first three columns (Invocations, Sneak Attack, Eldritch Blast) -- not every level must grant a named special ability, so long as he's getting something good.

Possibly add Trap Sense back if you need a filler, it's far less problematic than Impromptu Sneak Attack.

Finally, I'd just grant him Simple weapons. Rogues need bows (etc.) because they don't get Eldritch Blast. It's a small thing, but IMHO that intrudes unnecessarily onto the Rogue's domain.

Cheers, -- N

 

[BartD]

Hi Nifft, thanks for some really good comments. I'm actually not too keen on Impromptu SA either (let him take the invisibility invocation), it was really just a leftover from the Arcane Trickster - gone now. I have also taken some of your other suggestions; delayed DR and removed Fiendish Resilience but addeed Trapsense (which I really don't think is a big deal). I may want to add the sap as a weapon proficiency, though.
Also added Prestidigitation (as spell at will) at level 1

Comments wanted!

Eldritch Rogue

HD, BAB, Saves: As bard. Proficiencies: As warlock (simple, light).
Skill points: 6 + intelligence modifier.
Class skills: As rogue plus Concentration, Knowledge (arcana, planes), Spellcraft.
Special abilities (level 11, 14, 17, 20): As rogue plus may take Extra Invocation and Imbue Item (from level 14).

[B]Level	E.Blast/SneakA	Invoc	Specials[/B]	
1	1d6			Trapfinding, Prestidigitation
2		1d6	Least	Detect magic
3				Evasion
4	2d6		2	Trapsense +1
5		2d6		Uncanny dodge
6			3	Deceive item
7	3d6			Trapsense +2
8		3d6	Lesser	Improved uncanny dodge
9				DR 2/cold iron
10	4d6		5	Trapsense +3
11		4d6		Special ability
12			6	DR 3/cold iron
13	5d6			Trapsense +4
14		5d6	Greater	Special ability
15				DR 4/cold iron
16	6d6		8	Trapsense +5
17		6d6		Special ability
18			9	DR 5/cold iron
19	7d6			Trapsense +6
20	 	7d6	Dark	Special ability

 

[Nifft]

I like your changes. The class hangs together better as a whole now. (You may want to use the "Edit" button to replace the table in the 1st post, so newcomers see the new one instead.)

I also agree regarding the Sap. That's a key part of the Rogue's arsenal.

Cheers, -- N

 

[neceros]

Where is Prestidigitation from? I know it's a spell, but why do you have it here as a class ability?

Second, Trap Sense is one of those abilities that nobody really ever wants. Why 'fill' a class with abilities no body likes? Why not, instead, just give them an ability that is useful once?

Might I suggest Impromptu Sneak Attack? I know it looks silly, but it can be useful.

 

[Falling Icicle]

Instead of giving a specific EB and invocation progression, just give +1 invoker level at each class level. This would improve the Warlock's Eldritch blast, caster level and give new invocations known as if he had gained a level of warlock. Also, giving the trapfinding ability is unnecessary, since rogues already get that ability. Instead of giving prestidigitation at will, I would give them this invocation:

Eldritch Trickery
Least; 2nd
This invocation allows the warlock to use mage hand as the spell, except that the weight limit is increased to 5 pounds per level. Additionally, he may use his disable device, open lock and sleight of hand skills at range by telekinetically manipulating distant objects.

If you want to create an ability that helps combine sneak attack and eldritch blast, you could give them a special ability that lets them sneak attack with eldritch blast out to 60 feet, instead of the normal 30 feet. Call it Eldritch Precision or something like that.

As the combination of caster levels, sneak attack and eldritch blast is already potent enough, I would leave it at that. Giving them damage reduction and other powers in addition to this would, IMHO, overpower the class. It might be too powerful already, considering the deadly synergy between sneak attack and eldritch blast that allows a warlock to put out a frightening amount of damage each round, especially if he has retributive invisibility. If it turns out to be too powerful in play, take out a few of the caster levels, at 3rd, 6th and 10th level, for example.

 

[Falling Icicle]

Also, being a prestige class, it should have entry requirements. I would recommend the following:

Requirements:

Alignment: Any non-lawful.

Skills: Decipher Script 7 ranks, Disable Device 7 ranks, Escape Artist 7 ranks, Knowledge (Arcana) 4 ranks.

Special: Sneak attack +2d6, Eldritch Blast 2d6

 

[Nifft]

Also, being a prestige class

(Pssst! Count the levels.)

Cheers, -- N