"Elements of Magic" and other systems

[Bloodstone Mage]

I'm interested in Elements of Magic. I was wondering if anyone could give me a brief introduction on how its system works.
Also, I've been searching for it online, and I'm curious. Is it coming to print soon? On many sites, I see different page numbers, which leads me to hoping that it is.
I need a new magic system. If I don't get Elements of Magic or if I don't like that system, I'll probably resort to using a homebrew Final Fantasy 7/8 magic system based on getting spells from draw points that are cracks in the planet's stream of life, or something similar to that.

 

[Deadguy]

A brief supporting interjection. I recently bought Elements of Magic (nicely written book, btw; hats off to Matt Blakeley). And I too would like to know, from those who have tried it, how the system plays out.

 

[s/LaSH]

It works like this: single-purpose spell lists. You learn them once, and ramp up in power with them. There's a heavy elemental configuration aspect, so you could learn Evoke Area Fire or Wall Of Lightning or something. I haven't actually used it, but it seems to do just about everything the core rules can do and fill in a lot of the gaps at the same time (want to cast Frostball? How about a level 8 curse or giving someone regeneration? It's all there). One other thing it's changed is a bunch of spells like divinations and dispel magic; they're now skills.

The book provides a bunch of classes and guidelines on adapting the new magic into old classes like the paladin, and should be compatible with core D&D rules, so you can have both by-the-book magic and Elemental mages (well, they're called mages; there's no distinction between arcane, divine and psionic ability in EoM) running around side by side.

 

[RangerWickett]

Hm. How timely. Right now Matt Blakeley and I are busy revising the book significantly. We figured that since 3.5e was coming out, we might as well use it as an excuse to fix some of the problems in the original Elements of Magic system. I'm about to go to a game of my own (where I'll be playtesting the revisions!), but I can give you a quick overview of how the system will work in its revised version.

brb

 

[RangerWickett]

Okay, first, there is no difference between arcane or divine magic, or between magic and psionics. EOM presents rules that can cover any type of magic system you want, and we give guidelines for if you want to have an arcane/divine division, but it's not necessary. We give you a sturdy skeleton and musculature, and then help you design the flesh you want for your game.

There is a single spellcasting progression, with caster level ranging from 1/2 to 20. Some classes, like the paladin, get incremental caster level increases, while the primary spellcasting class, the Mage, gets it at a 1 for 1 basis. The Mage class has access to any type of magic, but few other abilities. Other classes are restricted to what types of magic they can learn, but gain other benefits to balance it out. Since there's just one caster level table, levels of different spellcasting classes stack. You can take some levels of Mage, then a few more levels of paladin, if you want. On the paladin levels you'll be limited to the types of new magic you can learn, but you can still cast all your old magic.

The actual system of spells uses Magic Points (MP) instead of spell slots, and spells cost from 0 to 20 MP. A 1 MP spell is about equivalent to a 1st level core D&D spell, 3 MP = a 2nd level spell, 7 MP = 4th level spell, etc.

Instead of learning specific spells, like Flaming Sphere or Burning Hands, you learn spell lists, like Evoke Fire. When you know a spell list, you can cast it at whatever power level you want (limited of course by your caster level). Thus, a 5th level Mage could cast Evoke Fire as a cantrip (0 MP) and do minimum damage, or cast it as a long bolt of flame that does 5d6 points of damage (5 MP). Each spell list is flexible, so Evoke Fire can pretty much handle any sort of damaging fire spell you'd want.

At each level you learn a few spell lists, up to a total of 45 if you're a 20th level caster (this number may change; we're tweaking it).

Spell Types
There are 10 (or 11) spell types. When you learn a spell list, you combine a spell type with an [alignment], [creature], or [element] type. For example, Abjure Evil is a different spell list than Abjure Shadow. A Charm Good spell would let you inspire your good-aligned allies, but wouldn't benefit evil creatures in the area, while a Charm Humanoid spell would affect all humanoids, but not any non-humanoid creatures.

• Abjure Alignment, Creature, or Element. These are protective spells.
• Charm Alignment or Creature. These spells influence emotion, causing friendship, fear, rage, etc.
• Compel Alignment or Creature. These spells control behavior directly.
• Create Creature or Element. These spells temporarily create objects or creatures of the chosen type. We're thinking of splitting it into Create Element and Summon Creature, so this is why there might be 11 spell lists instead of 10.
• Evoke Alignment or Element. These spells deal damage of the chosen type.
• Heal with Alignment or Element. These spells cure damage or other afflictions on creatures of the chosen alignment or element type (for instance, most things are 'Life' creatures, but you have 'Fire' creatures like elementals, 'Death' creatures like undead, etc.).
• Illusion Element. These spells create false sensory effects.
• Infuse with Element. These spells enhance creature's ability scores, and have other related effects.
• Move Element. These spells let you move things through a certain type of element. Move Air lets you fly or levitate objects, Move Dimension lets you teleport and planeshift, etc.
• Transform Creature or Element. These spells alter shape and substance.

Elements
There are 22 elements.
6 cardinal elements. Life, Death, Air, Earth, Fire, Water.
4 para elements. Lightning, Ooze, Ice, and Lava.
4 positive elements. Light, Crystal, Sound, and Mist.
4 negative elements. Shadow, Metal, Void, and Acid.
4 unifying elements. These are the freaky ones. Time, Dimension, Force, and Nature.

Also, you have a few magical skills that handle unique abilities. Scrying and Dispelling Magic are their own skills, and Spellcraft gain a few abilities that let you detect magic directly if you spend MP.

For instance, one PC that is in my game tonight is based on a druid and has Abjure Animal, Abjure Nature, Abjure Fire, Charm Animal, Compel Animal, Compel Plant, Create Animal, Evoke Nature, Evoke Fire, Infuse with Life, Move Nature, Move Earth, Transform Humanoid, Transform Plant, and Transform Animal. For each of these spell lists, he has a few specific spells that he uses more often (signature spells), which save time when he might be tempted to spend 10 minutes trying to min-max a spell. It's been fun so far.

 

[Bloodstone Mage]

Only one thing I can say: awesome.
I love what I've seen! This is much better than any other system that I deliberated using. I can't wait to use it!
I owe many thanks to you, Ranger Wickett! Any chance I might see Elements of Magic in print anytime soon?

 

[Matt Black]

I've run one game using Elements of Magic. I found the system extremely flexible and adaptible to different character concepts. I also really like the spell list idea - spell lists give great guidelines for the power level of spontaneous magic. They tell a mage exactly what he can and can't do. I loved the quirky special powers than magic-users got to choose from. They really help make each different, and give the feel that magic-users are somehow touched by supernatural forces.

Problems, some of which it look like they may be addressed in the next version:

There is some effort made to encourage themed caster types - you have grey, red, green, etc mages which have access to different sets of elements and targets, but because it's so easy to multi-class (your caster level keeps going up), you only have to take a single level of general mage to give your druid teleport and invisibility.

Related to this is the fact that you get HEAPS of spell lists (partially necessary because you have to buy 'charm', 'abjure', etc. for every creature type & element separately. But it does mean that you can easily burn a single spell list or two for a very powerful magic type, which may not be particularly appropriate to your caster type.

There is some encouragement to stick to a smaller set of magic themes - you gain slight bonuses for buying the same spell list for a number of different creatures or elements. However I think that more could be done in this regard - for example, feats might be created to steer casters in a particular direction. If you've spent a feat on becoming a 'master summoner' then you're going to want to invest more spell lists in summoning. Also, you could make it so that it's cheaper to buy spell lists for other creature types or elements once you've invested in your first.

We also found that the system was a little time-intensive. You get so many spell lists at higher levels that high level mages take a long time to create, which can be a pain for DMs. Each spell list implies a large number of individual spells - at least one per spell level, but potentially many more. With dozens of spell lists, magic-users have a lot to choose from. This is mostly good for PCs, but made NPC casters tricky to run. Some guidelines to simplify NPC casters would have been helpful.

The system works best when the players have strong character concepts, and are willing to restrict themselves to those concepts when choosing spell lists. Two of my players made a necromancer/death-priest and an artificer/alchemist. These worked well, but even created at 4th level took a while to put together.

A question for RangerWickett: Will the revised version be free to those who paid for V1.0? Really looking forward to seeing it.

MB

 

[SpuneDagr]

I bought the PDF of EoM and I LOVE IT!!! I'm currently playing a mage in my friend's campaign and I love coming up with cool names and concepts for all my spells (which are pretty much just evoke element). It's a lot of fun and allows so much flexibility!

I second the previous question. Will the updated version be free for those who bought the original?

 

[RangerWickett]

The revisions will be available for free, but mind you it won't contain everything you need for a full spellcasting system. We're including revisions of everything that was in the original EOM, but the lion's share of new material, like rules for magic item creation, prestige classes, really complex spells, and other nifty stuff will be in a sequel book that we're planning, Lyceian Arcana. We won't get the official green light on that book unless people respond favorably to the revisions, but I'm enheartened to see people liking them already. The revisions will also include a small teaser of Lyceian Arcana.

Oh, and to address the concerns mentioned above, about too many spell lists and the slowness of creating spells from scratch, I think you'll like how we've fixed things. The new rules use "signature spell" rules. Normal spellcasting takes a full-round action, but you can have a number of signature spells equal to your caster level plus your Int modifier, which can be cast as a standard action.

A signature spell is a specific usage of a spell list. For example, Evoke Lightning 12 could be a crackling cone of electricity, a single streaking missile, or a surging blade of blue energy, and you could choose any of these or numerous others, but casting them would require a free action. However, you might have the signature spell "Bolt from the Blue," which you can cast as a standard action. If the situation demands a specific type of spell, you can always take longer and make it, but usually you'll want to rely on signature spells.

Bolt from the Blue
Evoke Lightning 12
Components: V, S
Range: Medium (150 ft.)
Duration: Instantaneous
Area of Effect: 20-ft. radius
Saving Throw: Reflex half, plus special
Spell Resistance: Yes

Bolt from the Blue causes a stroke of lightning to fall from above, dealing 12d6 points of lightning damage to creatures and objects in the area of effect. Creatures damaged by this spell must succeed a Fortitude save or be stunned for 1 round. Thereafter, creatures that fail their save must make another Fortitude save each round, until they succeed and break out of the stun, or until 5 more rounds pass.


This spell is about equivalent to a 6th level spell in standard D&D terms.

Additionally, we've reduced the number of spell lists you automatically learn, but increased the options for using new spells. If you find a spellbook, you'll be able to try to cast spells out of it, even if you don't know them, but doing so takes a long time, costs MP just like a normal spell, and carries a risk of failure. You know how mages are always getting tempted by dark powers that might be beyond their control? Well, we have ways of handling that in game.

 

[Heretic Apostate]

So basically Elements of Magic is a spell-seed, spontaneous-casting system. Cool.

How does it handle:
1) Clerics (domains, for instance; what's the cost/benefit from aligning yourself with a god?)
2) Metamagic feats (do they figure into the system?)

It sounds like it's something I might like. How much does it cost, and where can I get it? (Preferably, a method that allows for multiple attempts at downloading, because my connection tends to disconnect.)

And RW, did you ever write up all those cool arcane spellcasters you teased us about, before Tome & Blood came out?