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Essentials Game Day recap
- Thread starter OnlineDM
- Start date
From what I understand the Dragons in the Monster Vault (Of which I think the Black Dragon is from that) are just obscenely brutal in general. I mean, if you're going to put "DRAGONS" in the title, you might as well make them have the biggest balls of any monster around as well. It's interesting to hear how it went though, my level 4 party only barely handled the higher level one! But that was a really satisfying battle.
Tony Vargas
Legend
I had resolved to give Essentials a fair shake at Game Day, but I'm going to have to renew that resolution and give it a fair shake at Encounters, instead. Our FLGS had just enough players for two tables at game day (we run three or four for Encounters). One of the DMs was a regular DM, the other was trying out DMing 4e for the first time. Luck of the draw, I got the newbie. The game was a fiasco. I can't blame it on the system, though, so I'm willing to give it another chance.
Things I did notice. The Slayers (I got to play one of them) felt a /lot/ like 1e Fighters, which is kinda cool nostalgia in a small dose like this, though it was wearing thin by the fourth encounter. The player who got the Theif never used any of his 'move' Tricks, which was disapointing, and thus didn't get CA much - he'd played 4e before, but never a rogue, so maybe he just wasn't sure what to do with it. The Warpriest proved pretty effective, not the healer a conventional 4e Cleric is, but adequate, and his attacks seemed to target Will pretty heavily and to do good damage. The Mage was a surprise, on paper, it looked truely pathetic, with very low attack bonuses, even for a 2nd-level implement user, and doing very little damage. The player used him well, though. Beguiling Strands re-arranged the battlefield at will, the Red Box Magic Missle (auto-damage to two targets) was pretty effective, there was an encounter burst 1 that dazed, and the Fireball-ish power turned out to create an encounter-long zone.
The adventure, like I said, didn't get a fair shake from the inexperienced DM, so it's hard to draw any strong conclusions about Essentials. That the Red Box seems to deviate a bit from the rest of Essentials also makes me think I should reserve judgement.
Things I did notice. The Slayers (I got to play one of them) felt a /lot/ like 1e Fighters, which is kinda cool nostalgia in a small dose like this, though it was wearing thin by the fourth encounter. The player who got the Theif never used any of his 'move' Tricks, which was disapointing, and thus didn't get CA much - he'd played 4e before, but never a rogue, so maybe he just wasn't sure what to do with it. The Warpriest proved pretty effective, not the healer a conventional 4e Cleric is, but adequate, and his attacks seemed to target Will pretty heavily and to do good damage. The Mage was a surprise, on paper, it looked truely pathetic, with very low attack bonuses, even for a 2nd-level implement user, and doing very little damage. The player used him well, though. Beguiling Strands re-arranged the battlefield at will, the Red Box Magic Missle (auto-damage to two targets) was pretty effective, there was an encounter burst 1 that dazed, and the Fireball-ish power turned out to create an encounter-long zone.
The adventure, like I said, didn't get a fair shake from the inexperienced DM, so it's hard to draw any strong conclusions about Essentials. That the Red Box seems to deviate a bit from the rest of Essentials also makes me think I should reserve judgement.
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Kurtomatic
First Post
Thanks! Good to know. By the OP's description it sounded just like the level 4 version, which would have been beyond brutal.
We played with only 4 PCs, but with experienced players, and had no one go down at all (not even unconscious). We had the dwarf fighter, cleric, mage, and halfling thief. We did all 5 encounters (the table next to us skipped the undead room), taking 5 hours.
I played at the same table as Tony Vargas above, and while he thought it was fiasco due to the newbie DM, I thought it went fine, but agree that the DM's inexperience got in the way and it would have gone better with someone else. The DM plays in my group every week, so I knew what to expect, but Tony didn't, so I understand his disappointment. But every DM needs a first time, though in retrospect, I should have suggested that he do an Encounters or one of our weekly sessions first... (Although my first time wasn't too bad since I was DMing a group of newbies at just one encounter per week, so there weren't expectations.)
Overall, I thought that the cleric "war priest" was the most useful character, and the one that was most necessary to have in the party, for a variety of reasons.
I ended up with the wizard / mage, and thought he was kinda a lame character at first (and considered switching to the human fighter), but then he ended up being really useful. His Beguiling Strands blast 5 attack was quite useful for the slide 5 side-effect, the daily Flame Fountain had a perfect use in the adventure, and the magic missile was perfect for dealing with minions at range (as one would expect). When I play, I like to play melee characters (Warden is my favorite class), but on Game Days, I try to play something new, so the wizard was a good choice for me.
For me, there were two points where the wizard really shined.
The first was in the lower room with the orcs and the runes on the floor. I did the first attack with the blast 5 and then slid the ones affected to spaces with runes in them for additional damage. The next round someone said that since the runes triggered when one entered the squares, I could move the enemy onto multiple rune squares. (Although Tony had said that moving them back and forth onto the same square was too silly to be valid, so I resisted doing that.) I was even able to move one of them onto 4 rune squares with a 5 slide, for lots of damage, sadly ending in its death. (Boo hoo...)
The second was in the lower room with the undead. Right when we went in, the other PCs delayed and I immediately used my daily Flame Fountain to create flames blocking the doorway which last until the end of the encounter. So, the zombies and skeletons quickly entered the flames, taking 5 points. The fighter and cleric then hit those that they could. On my turn, I then used the blast 5 attack, hit nearly all of them, and then slid them all 5 away. On their turn, they move back into the flame for 5 more damage. Fighter and Cleric hit, I them move them away again, and they then move back into the flame. That continued until they were all dead, when they rise, immediately take 5 more fire damage, and then vaporize again. The party probably only took 1 hit in that entire encounter despite the 6 or so zombies and 6 or so skeletons.
The last room basically turned into the wizard hanging back and taking care of the minions while the other 3 handled the dragon and two toughies. We were thinking that it might end with a TPK after the first round or two, but it quickly turned when the dragon wasn't as tough as we thought it would be after its horrible breath attacks. I had the wizard use the slide on the dragon twice, where I discovered accidentally that sliding it into the brazier square gave it extra fire damage (and burned the cleric). So in a later turn, I did that again (but while intentionally missing the PCs).
In all, I think that the wizard made a huge difference in the adventure. Had I chosen the other fighter or other rogue, I could certainly have seen us as another TPK in the final battle due to damage taken earlier leading to at least one player death.
But most important, I had a good time with the introduction to the new game system, and that's the most important thing.
I played at the same table as Tony Vargas above, and while he thought it was fiasco due to the newbie DM, I thought it went fine, but agree that the DM's inexperience got in the way and it would have gone better with someone else. The DM plays in my group every week, so I knew what to expect, but Tony didn't, so I understand his disappointment. But every DM needs a first time, though in retrospect, I should have suggested that he do an Encounters or one of our weekly sessions first... (Although my first time wasn't too bad since I was DMing a group of newbies at just one encounter per week, so there weren't expectations.)
Overall, I thought that the cleric "war priest" was the most useful character, and the one that was most necessary to have in the party, for a variety of reasons.
I ended up with the wizard / mage, and thought he was kinda a lame character at first (and considered switching to the human fighter), but then he ended up being really useful. His Beguiling Strands blast 5 attack was quite useful for the slide 5 side-effect, the daily Flame Fountain had a perfect use in the adventure, and the magic missile was perfect for dealing with minions at range (as one would expect). When I play, I like to play melee characters (Warden is my favorite class), but on Game Days, I try to play something new, so the wizard was a good choice for me.
For me, there were two points where the wizard really shined.
The first was in the lower room with the orcs and the runes on the floor. I did the first attack with the blast 5 and then slid the ones affected to spaces with runes in them for additional damage. The next round someone said that since the runes triggered when one entered the squares, I could move the enemy onto multiple rune squares. (Although Tony had said that moving them back and forth onto the same square was too silly to be valid, so I resisted doing that.) I was even able to move one of them onto 4 rune squares with a 5 slide, for lots of damage, sadly ending in its death. (Boo hoo...)
The second was in the lower room with the undead. Right when we went in, the other PCs delayed and I immediately used my daily Flame Fountain to create flames blocking the doorway which last until the end of the encounter. So, the zombies and skeletons quickly entered the flames, taking 5 points. The fighter and cleric then hit those that they could. On my turn, I then used the blast 5 attack, hit nearly all of them, and then slid them all 5 away. On their turn, they move back into the flame for 5 more damage. Fighter and Cleric hit, I them move them away again, and they then move back into the flame. That continued until they were all dead, when they rise, immediately take 5 more fire damage, and then vaporize again. The party probably only took 1 hit in that entire encounter despite the 6 or so zombies and 6 or so skeletons.
The last room basically turned into the wizard hanging back and taking care of the minions while the other 3 handled the dragon and two toughies. We were thinking that it might end with a TPK after the first round or two, but it quickly turned when the dragon wasn't as tough as we thought it would be after its horrible breath attacks. I had the wizard use the slide on the dragon twice, where I discovered accidentally that sliding it into the brazier square gave it extra fire damage (and burned the cleric). So in a later turn, I did that again (but while intentionally missing the PCs).
In all, I think that the wizard made a huge difference in the adventure. Had I chosen the other fighter or other rogue, I could certainly have seen us as another TPK in the final battle due to damage taken earlier leading to at least one player death.
But most important, I had a good time with the introduction to the new game system, and that's the most important thing.
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Reaper Steve
Explorer
I ran it and had a blast, and my players said they did as well.
I beefed up the encounters to handle 6 players, but wound up with 7. Ugh. Not enough to have two tables, and I didn't want to turn anyone away. Made for a long game... at least 7 hours for 4 encounters. In my experience, every player beyond 5 exponentially makes the game longer.
Anyway... I didn't like the nostaglic balck and white map, so I busted out all my tiles (I'm a crazy with 2 sets of each) and created each map completely with tiles. I even elevated the dias (Sinister Woods?) and placed animated statues figures on it. It was sharp looking.
For the first encounter, I also used lightly wooded tiles to have a 20-square deep approach to the temple, so the players had to rush through hails of arrows and charging drakes. When it was over, half the party was bloodied and they were spread all over the place.
Second fight was also tough, even though they founatin of flamed my orc pretty quick. Some humor ensured when one mage cast light on one statue and then the other cast ghost sound to it to speak as an avatar of a god. Great plan and roleplaying, so I let him make an intimidate check against the kobolds on the dias! Again, about half the party bloodied, including a mage with 1 HP cowering around the corner from the fight.
The party also choose door #1. They really had fun using beguiling strands to move my guys over as many runes as possible. Aside: thank goodness that the HotFL book updates beguiling strands from the red box (and pregens.) Pregens: slide 5 squares(!), HotFL: push 3 squares. I let them play it according to the cards but told them that was the only time I would do so.
The dragon fight was awesome. About half the party acted before the dragon, and thanks to two ranged backstabbing rogues and a founatin of flame, he was quickly bloodied (and breathed on the dwarf!) and then dazed+no charge by the other mage. It was looking like a pushover but Blightborn ran around the wall behind the gong and his 3 hobgoblins (for 6 players) held the line.
The dwarf fighter made a mad dash across the chamber to charge the dragon, but fell to hobgoblin opportuity attacks and readied charges. (He dies next round due to ongoing acid damage.) Charging orcs dished out some nice damage.
That bought the dragon time to circle the wall and charge the elf rogue and then action point to claw both rogues. Result = one bloodied rogue, one dying. The tables were turned and things looked grim for the heroes. Next turn, the dragon recharged his breath and all thought that both rogues and a mage were doomed, but he failed to hit any of them!
More beguiling strands and the dragon and hobgobs are dancing through the fountain of flames and burning. This gives the not-unconscious rogue a backstab and he puts the dragon out of their misery while the cleric finshed off the remaining hobgob. With one character dead, another unconscious, and all the remaining ones bloodied, it turned out to be an epic fight!
It could have been much worse. I forgot to do half damage on the missed breath attack, which would have killed the dying rogue and would also have dropped the bloodied one. I also forgot the Acidic blood damage a time or two. Finally, the cheese version of beguiling strands (and two mages in the group) was the only thing that could get the dragon and hobgobs off the party and back into the fountain of flame.
Again, I had a great time. Every encounter was tense and the last was extra memorable. I hate forgetting effects, but I forgot just enough to turn a TPK into an "OMG, I can't believe we survived!" legend.
I beefed up the encounters to handle 6 players, but wound up with 7. Ugh. Not enough to have two tables, and I didn't want to turn anyone away. Made for a long game... at least 7 hours for 4 encounters. In my experience, every player beyond 5 exponentially makes the game longer.
Anyway... I didn't like the nostaglic balck and white map, so I busted out all my tiles (I'm a crazy with 2 sets of each) and created each map completely with tiles. I even elevated the dias (Sinister Woods?) and placed animated statues figures on it. It was sharp looking.
For the first encounter, I also used lightly wooded tiles to have a 20-square deep approach to the temple, so the players had to rush through hails of arrows and charging drakes. When it was over, half the party was bloodied and they were spread all over the place.
Second fight was also tough, even though they founatin of flamed my orc pretty quick. Some humor ensured when one mage cast light on one statue and then the other cast ghost sound to it to speak as an avatar of a god. Great plan and roleplaying, so I let him make an intimidate check against the kobolds on the dias! Again, about half the party bloodied, including a mage with 1 HP cowering around the corner from the fight.
The party also choose door #1. They really had fun using beguiling strands to move my guys over as many runes as possible. Aside: thank goodness that the HotFL book updates beguiling strands from the red box (and pregens.) Pregens: slide 5 squares(!), HotFL: push 3 squares. I let them play it according to the cards but told them that was the only time I would do so.
The dragon fight was awesome. About half the party acted before the dragon, and thanks to two ranged backstabbing rogues and a founatin of flame, he was quickly bloodied (and breathed on the dwarf!) and then dazed+no charge by the other mage. It was looking like a pushover but Blightborn ran around the wall behind the gong and his 3 hobgoblins (for 6 players) held the line.
The dwarf fighter made a mad dash across the chamber to charge the dragon, but fell to hobgoblin opportuity attacks and readied charges. (He dies next round due to ongoing acid damage.) Charging orcs dished out some nice damage.
That bought the dragon time to circle the wall and charge the elf rogue and then action point to claw both rogues. Result = one bloodied rogue, one dying. The tables were turned and things looked grim for the heroes. Next turn, the dragon recharged his breath and all thought that both rogues and a mage were doomed, but he failed to hit any of them!
More beguiling strands and the dragon and hobgobs are dancing through the fountain of flames and burning. This gives the not-unconscious rogue a backstab and he puts the dragon out of their misery while the cleric finshed off the remaining hobgob. With one character dead, another unconscious, and all the remaining ones bloodied, it turned out to be an epic fight!
It could have been much worse. I forgot to do half damage on the missed breath attack, which would have killed the dying rogue and would also have dropped the bloodied one. I also forgot the Acidic blood damage a time or two. Finally, the cheese version of beguiling strands (and two mages in the group) was the only thing that could get the dragon and hobgobs off the party and back into the fountain of flame.
Again, I had a great time. Every encounter was tense and the last was extra memorable. I hate forgetting effects, but I forgot just enough to turn a TPK into an "OMG, I can't believe we survived!" legend.
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filthgrinder
First Post
You don't let players roll their own death saves?
Nope, I roll for them in secret. It adds suspense, the players don't know how close to death their ally is. Falling down in my games becomes a serious matter quickly. They can't rely on the unconcious player to tell them to ignore him a round since he made his save, thus reducing the metagaming. If that player falls and stays down more than two rounds before an extended rest, they truly fear letting that player fall again as his next save attempt might be his last. After taking an extended rest to restore death saving throws to 3, I will let them know how close to death they came.
TarionzCousin
Second Most Angelic Devil Ever
Great recaps everyone. Thanks.
Is there a link to this adventure? I would like to see the "new" style.
Is there a link to this adventure? I would like to see the "new" style.
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