Evasion vs Mettle

[Majushi]

Hi guys. I was wondering if anyone has taken a moment to calculate how many area and close attacks target the four defenses, and more specifically how many of them do half damage on miss?

With these numbers, what would be the best Paragon Feat:

Evasion (Ref + AC) or Mettle (Fort + Will).

 

[AndrewRF]

Interesting question. I did a quick pass through the MM and this is what I came up with for close and area attacks that deal half damage on a miss:

AC: 2
Reflex: 24 (10 just from dragon breath weapons)
Fort: 13
Will: 4

 

[Mort_Q]

Why not take both!?

 

[Danceofmasks]

'cos you have to build for them.
If your defense scores are mediocre, your foes are not going to miss.
The feat will then be useless.

 

[chaotix42]

Interesting question. I did a quick pass through the MM and this is what I came up with for close and area attacks that deal half damage on a miss:

AC: 1
Reflex: 26 (10 just from dragon breath weapons)
Fort: 13
Will: 4

Good job! Now get to work on the PHB for all those NPCs/templated monsters out there.

 

[Majushi]

Interesting question. I did a quick pass through the MM and this is what I came up with for close and area attacks that deal half damage on a miss:

AC: 1
Reflex: 26 (10 just from dragon breath weapons)
Fort: 13
Will: 4

Awesome.

So in theory Evasion is best choice. If Dragons didn't exist it would be 50 / 50.

 

[KarinsDad]

Awesome.

So in theory Evasion is best choice. If Dragons didn't exist it would be 50 / 50.

It depends.

With there being ~490 creatures in the MM, that means that 27/490 or about 1 in 18 where Evasion might help. But, this help can be limited. For a Rogue or Wizard with a high Reflex, it helps quite a bit. They get missed quite a bit.

For other PCs, it typically doesn't make as much sense (unless the DM is going to throw a lot of Dragons at the PCs).

Mettle makes even less sense for any PC. 17/490 or about 1 in 29 creatures is just a waste of a feat, even for high Fort and Will PCs. The feat will just not come into play that often.

 

[Mort_Q]

It depends.

Urban campaigns versus classic delves!

Some DMs never use the same monsters twice... some like a thematic approach with slight variations.

 

[Palladion]

It depends.

With there being ~490 creatures in the MM, that means that 27/490 or about 1 in 18 where Evasion might help. But, this help can be limited. For a Rogue or Wizard with a high Reflex, it helps quite a bit. They get missed quite a bit.

For other PCs, it typically doesn't make as much sense (unless the DM is going to throw a lot of Dragons at the PCs).

Mettle makes even less sense for any PC. 17/490 or about 1 in 29 creatures is just a waste of a feat, even for high Fort and Will PCs. The feat will just not come into play that often.

Very much agree with KarinsDad. Also not taken into account is what tiers these creatures are at, given Evasion and Mettle can only be taken at paragon (and probably not facing many heroic tier creatures after that point). Probably a better bet to take a defense feat (i.e. Lightning Reflexes) to decrease the chance of getting hit.

 

[Stalker0]

Very much agree with KarinsDad. Also not taken into account is what tiers these creatures are at, given Evasion and Mettle can only be taken at paragon (and probably not facing many heroic tier creatures after that point). Probably a better bet to take a defense feat (i.e. Lightning Reflexes) to decrease the chance of getting hit.

Its fine if certain feats at the same tier aren't as strong as another one if they both stack together. In this case, l. reflexes is probably the better choice. However, for the person who wants to continue his reflexive route, evasion may be a nice alternative for him.

As others have mentioned, the feats are dependent on monsters, which are dependent on the DM. For example, some people really like mind flayer campaigns. In that case, mettle is a solid feat.