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D&D 5E FGG Kickstarter The Blight Richard Pett's Crooked City

Charles Wright

First Post
Guys, it is estimated that the book is going to be 900 pages long in Pathfinder rules.

As the guy who will be doing the layout, I really want to clarify that point.
 

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Charles Wright

First Post
I mentioned this in the Pathfinder forum thread, but it is difficult for me to reconcile the idea that they presented the Borderlands kickstarter as testing the waters for future 5E editions of products and rolled this kickstarter out before completing the Backer Kits for the last one so they could actually look at the data. I know on a rational basis that they have business decisions driving that (printer time and resources already deployed), but as a 5E fan that wants to be a Lost Lands fan (I have genuinely never read a negative review about their material), it feels a little irrationally insulting.


The plans for The Blight were set in motion long before we ran the kickstarter for The Borderlands Provinces (we start working on them 6 months to a year out). It isn't meant as an insult to anybody and one of the owners (me) has 5E as a preferred system.

You have to understand that we know there's a market for 3PP Monster books and adventures, but we aren't too sure about large, black and white books and how they will be received by the 5E base. Many people won't even look at a book if it isn't full color. Couple that with most minimum orders from our printer being 500 copies, it's a huge gamble on our part at the moment. (We also have to store any unsold merchandise... so if 200 people buy the 5E version, we're storing 300 HUGE books as an expense in our already over-burdened warehouses.)

I'm not making excuses here, just trying to explain the logistics.

By the way, going full color is something that we really have to examine as it would mean a complete restructuring of our current business model. Art would cost much more as well as printing.
 

You have to understand that we know there's a market for 3PP Monster books and adventures, but we aren't too sure about large, black and white books and how they will be received by the 5E base.

Perfectly understood, from here at least. I don't envy the position you're in, or begrudge you the choice you made. I hope the Kickstarter does amazingly. :)

But the flip side of that is that I can't afford to back a KS book, at the prices a book this large requires, if it's not for my preferred system. So as much as I love the idea behind this book, and as much as I love FGG/Necromancer--as both a fan and a writer who works with you--I'm probably going to have to sit this one out. :(

(I don't put that out there as any sort of ultimatum or even complaint, just a data point. And I mean it when I say I hope it does fantastically.)
 

Charles Wright

First Post
*nods* I totally get that, Ari. I'm actually excited to see people pledging a buck just so they can let us know that they want The Blight in 5E. It just takes a long time to shift gears and production (me) is currently being whipped to death! <grin>

(Bard's Gate is planned to have a 5E version, by the way.)
 

Can't wait for Bard's Gate in 5E, and thanks for your clarifications.

$32k down, $43k to go :D

EDIT: Just posted by Bill:

" Frog God Games about 2 hours ago
The 5e decision is being discussed, its not definite yet by any means. It would mean an extra $25k or so in cost though.
Bill"

So yeah you can see why it is hard to do!
 
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Matthan

Explorer
I want to repeat that I understand my response is both irrational and disproportionate on this. I completely understand that there are financial and logistical reasons outside of the customer's purview that dictate these choices. I also know that you're in a difficult spot at the moment. You've scoped out the project for S+W and Pathfinder and set your budget for the Kickstarter. You can't simply add in 5E as an option to the existing KS because it would throw off your budget. If you add it in as a Stretch Goal, the backers that get you to that stretch goal could rightly argue that they would prefer their funds go to making their own product better than creating a product they didn't initially agree to back. If you do a followup KS for a 5E Blight, you'll miss out on being able to use any funds that the 5E KS brings in to impact the overall work (For instance, if the 5E KS wildly overfunded to be able to make it a full-color product, you wouldn't be able to pass that back to the S+W and Pathfinder versions leaving you with a product that is markedly different between versions).

I'm not a publisher and I don't envy your position. If it's helpful, the positive spin on this is that you have people that want your products. I do want the KS to be wildly successful. When Bard's Gate rolls around for 5E, I'll back it on the first day. If you figure out a strategy for 5E Blight, I'll be there too.
 

Shadow Demon

Explorer
The 5e pdf of The Blight lives upon KS funding.

From Greg Vaughan on the Pathfinder thread:

We've been listening to the cries of the masses--crushed and beaten beneath the tyranny of The Blight's so-called "beloved" monarch--and we have heard you. Just announced: We are adding a 5e version of the pdf to the KS. For now it's just the pdf. Adding a print version of 5e to the KS adds considerably to our production cost, so we've got to make sure we make our funding goal for the physical versions we've committed to. However, once we've funded we'll be looking at a stretch goal to encompass the cost of a 5e printing. Get the details here!

Greg
 

Greg V

First Post
Ninja'd by Shadow Demon.

Hi Guys,

It's been pretty well said above, but just to reiterate. The lack of a 5e option this KS has nothing to do with not wanting a 5e option and everything to do with not knowing if there is enough 5e support specifically for OUR campaign setting. We know that there's a ton of 5e love out there, but WotC is producing campaign setting material so we don't know what the demand is for it from a 3PP. We do know the general demand from our PF and S&W fans, so we can handle the budgeting and financials of that. And for a book of this size and this expensive to produce, a mishandling of those can pretty much end Frog God Games. Combine that with the fact that this book and its KS have been in production for a couple years, long before our Borderland Provinces test was even conceived, and we had to proceed with what we knew. It is a substantial additional cost to print a third version, so we have to make sure we can reasonably anticipate it to fund and sell decently if we ever want to be able to make Bard's Gate Complete or any other book for that matter. And the timing of this KS has no relation with the survey results of Borderland Provinces because the planning was done months ago. And like Borderland Provinces, The Blight is a campaign setting heavy book, so it falls into that gray area of an untested market for us.

So blah, blah, yadda, yadda, business talk. I get it. I only said all that to make sure no one really thinks we're turning our nose up at the 5e audience. I assure you if you want us, we want you! (Okay, that sounded a little weird, but you get the idea).

So now to the point of my post:

FGG isn't a big company. We're a half-dozen guys with day jobs scattered around the country who do this in our spare time and either enjoy the rewards or personally eat the costs of how well the books we make do. So we seriously can't afford to go out on major limbs or put up large amounts of capital routinely (not to mention our wives killing us if we lose our shirts). However, your voice has been loud and clear on Borderland Provinces and in this KS as well. So we have marshaled the resources and committed to making a 5e version of The Blight. We're doing it as a pdf initially because the funding goal we have established for this KS doesn't cover the cost of a third printing. We've got to get the book funded overall before we can add on the stretch goal of printing the 5e version. However, the 5e pdf will happen regardless as long as we make the initial funding goal.

However, we're not just trying to milk the 5e audience. We do not want to try and fund the initial funding on your backs. That wouldn't be fair to you when we've got to hit a stretch goal anyway to be able to print the 5e version as well. So here's what you can do. Continue to post your support and spread the word. If you want a copy of The Blight regardless of whether it's in pdf or hardcover format, go ahead and pledge at the Squire level to get your pdf for sure. However, hold off on pledging at a physical copy level. The initial funding needs to be done primarily by the Pathfinder and Swords & Wizardry supporters. I feel pretty good about us making our funding goal for those, but it should not be done off of your pledges.

When we reach the initial funding goal we'll finish calculating exactly how much it will take to print the 5e edition and post it as a stretch goal update. That's where we'll need you to come in. If you pledged for the pdf but want the physical copy, then just increase the dollar amount up to the Veteran level where you'll receive the actual book but still get the pdf for free with it. If you were holding off altogether until the 5e physical book was on the table, then that's when we'll need you to come in and pledge and let us know. Even more so than the Borderland Provinces survey, if the 5e supporters hold off and then pledge towards the 5e stretch goal rather than just towards the initial goal then it'll really be your chance to shine and show us what kind of audience is out there wanting FGG books in 5e rules. If for some reason it looks like the 5e physical copy stretch goal isn't going to make, then on the last day you can reduce your pledge back to the pdf level amount (if you want it) or can drop it altogether so you're not stuck buying an expensive book in a rule system you don't want (I'm looking at you, Ari). ;-)

We don't question the number of 5e fans who are out there. We only question the number of 5e FGG fans there are since this is a new arena for us and we can't afford to make a costly error. In short, we think you guys are out there; we just have to pay the printer bills based on what we know is there. So set us straight. :)

For everyone who has pledged a dollar to show their support or just chimed in to voice an opinion or words of encouragement, we really appreciate it. I promise that if you show us that FGG has a viable 5e customer base we won't be able to start getting 5e FGG books into your hands fast enough.

Greg
 

Money, meet mouth.

Pledged at Squire level. :D (And believe me, I wouldn't spend that amount for just any PDF.)

Thank you for going above and beyond for the fans.
 


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