Fighter - a martial controller?

[Blackbrrd]

I was looking at the fighter and he can really do some damage with close burst 1 attacks which he has a lot of.

In addition he has a 7th level encounter power that is burst 3 that pulls enemies adjacent to him.

The likelihood of a fighter attacking 2-3 enemies at the time is in other words quite high, especially at level 7+. If you are fighting minions he will probably attack 5-6 times per standard action.

The fun begins when you take the fighter paragon path that lets you reuse an encounter power if you roll a critical. As the fighter is attacking 2-6 times per round before any action points, I foresee him getting at least one encounter power back each encounter...

 

[runnerXL]

The difference between the defender and the other roles is that he wants all those minions surrounding and attacking him, to keep the heat off the real strikers and controllers who don't want to be attacked

 

[Blackbrrd]

Yeah, I know, but he will do as good damage to multiple foes as the real controller because he, as I mentioned has a lot of close burst powers. In other words, the fighter acts more like a defender/controller than a controller.

It is really hard for foes to get away from the fighter after he has used come and get it, because he will have marked them all...

A fighter can easily do 1d10(bastard sword)+5(stat)+2(weapon)+1(feat)=13 damage to several targets at level 7+

 

[GoodKingJayIII]

I like that the Fighter seems to blend some of the other roles into his Defender category. While I think I'd call him a secondary Striker over Controller, he definitely has some great abilities that hinder his enemies. It's a nice mix.

I wonder if we'll see some more of the control aspect in the upcoming Swordmage.

 

[ki11erDM]

At level 1 you pick if you are going to be a controller or a striker. If you take two handed as your weapon focus you are (or should be) a striker. If you go with sword and board then you will be a controller. I am playing a controller version right now… damn fun.

 

[Lord Sessadore]

It's important to remember that the other defender, the paladin, has similar features. Leading me to believe that those striker-ish and controller-ish aspects of the class are, well, probably part of being a defender. It's not that fun for most people if all you can do is sit there and be a distraction. Most people playing a game like D&D (I say most because I mean most, not all) enjoy beating stuff up themselves too, or being awesome and hitting everything beside them.

The "controller" aspect of the class isn't really the same as the wizard controller - everyone has AOE effects, the true controller is the only one with an at-will AOE, and has a lot more of them in its power distribution, and a lot more rider effects or terrain changing effects on those AOE's.

As for strikers, they aren't really as durable as the defender, and they'll almost always outstrip the defender's damage by far.

All in all, I think those aspects are part of the defender role. You can't just be a turtle, otherwise why attack you? You have to be a viable threat to justify attention, otherwise you're just an annoyance.

 

[Cadfan]

Maybe the problem is a misunderstanding of the nature of "defenders" and "controllers?"

 

[Felon]

As im MMO's so it is in D&D: tanking generally just amounts to point-blank controller effects. It's "stay over here" as opposed to "stay over there".

 

[Anax]

It's worth noting that the "multi-target" abilities of defenders tend to be rather more constrained than those of controllers. Look at cleave vs. scorching burst: cleave will hit two enemies at most, and one of them won't be affected much unless he's a minion. If we assume the fighter is surrounded by minions, he's going to be able to clear two-ish a round (assuming he always hits.) It'll take him several rounds to be free of enemies, all of whom have a chance of hurting him.

The wizard, on the other hand, can scorching burst and take out three a round--assuming they're all packed around the fighter and he doesn't want to burn the fighter. If the fighter's willing to take one hit for 1d6+Int (2d6+Int at higher levels), the wizard can take all eight of them out at once. And if there are more enemies that are not yet surrounding the defender, the controller can fry up to nine of them at once.

At higher levels, defenders do tend to get more abilities that hit lots of enemies, but they still tend to be much much more constrained than controller abilities that hit lots of enemies. And, of course, defenders have to be up close and personal to do any of that.

Basically: Defenders bunch enemies up and keep them from attacking other players, but they've got to take some serious hits to do it. Controllers knock packed-up enemies down and break up their packs into smaller manageable pieces (by setting up obstacles and messing with movement).

A controller and a defender working together is optimal when faced with many weak enemies: The controller keeps too many enemies from getting to the defender at once. The defender prevents the enemies from getting to attack the relatively weaker controller and bunches them together (attacking him). The controller knocks down the enemies facing the defender, preventing him from taking too many hits and allowing him to gather up the next pack which is just getting out of the rough terrain the controller made. etc.

Against bigger opponents, the defender takes the big hits while the controller mops up any little guys, and again the controller helps keep the defender alive by interfering with the big enemy's attacks.