For the good of video games, Anthem needs to fail hard

[cbwjm]

I've literally only just heard about Anthem today. It sounds pretty cool, the only reason I'm not getting It is that I have too many other games or other media to get through.

 

[Imaculata]

Mass Effect 3's ending needed to bring it all full circle. Mass Effect 2's suicide mission was a perfect template for this. Everything you've worked towards during the game, gets a pay off at the end. But obviously ME3 needed to do a lot more, which isn't easy because of the issue with saves. The switching of engines between the various games just made continuity a huge problem. A lot of people who played ME2 never played ME1, or were unable to port their saves. ME3 needed to be an epic conclusion that paid off all the big storylines that the previous two games had set up. That was not an impossible task. Just merely paying lipservice to some of the choices would have made the ending a lot better. But instead we got one ending in three different colors. So, lets get that out of the way for a moment, we didn't get 3 different endings. We got 3 near identical endings that had different colors. This was the reason fans were so mad, along with the conclusion of the story being lazily written. ME3 is still a great game, but the ending was a dire disappointment.

Now, I don't mind that Bioware is working on something other than another RPG. Are they condemned to make only RPG's till the end of time? I don't think so, they can make what ever they want... but is Anthem what they truly wanted to make? I fear (and I suspect many others fear this too) that EA is pressuring lots of talented studios to make them live-service cash cows. That is my perception of it anyway. Given enough freedom, I think Bioware could make an amazing multiplayer looter-shooter that delivers the same kind of amazing storytelling that we know from their previous titles... but I don't think they have that freedom any more.

 

[MGibster]

It did have to stand alone, since something like 60% of people didn't copy a save.

I got the Geth and the Quarians to make peace in the third game. I got everyone to set aside their differences so we could go after the Reapers in the third game. The ending to ME3 didn't even reflect the choices I made in ME3.

Plus, the game was defined by two paths. Two choices. Renegade and Paragon. It made sense that the final moment would do the same. Adding a third middle path was almost excessive.

My renegade Shepherd would have rejected all three choices because they were all terrible.

I didn't mind that; I didn't want a mega-happy ending where there was no consequence or hard choice. Because if there was such an easy option, why would anyone take another option? If you could just send out a signal that turned off the Reapers, that'd feel anticlimactic.

When they revised the ending I picked the one where the Reapers eventually wiped us all out. It was the preferable ending to the others.

There needed to be a sacrifice: sacrifice yourself, sacrifice the Geth, or sacrifice people's identities.

From a narrative point of view a Pyrrhic victory is not satisfactory. But if you liked it, that's cool. But the criticisms of ME3s ending are well founded in my opinion.

 

[Jester David]

Wasn't that one of the added endings? Even with the free dlc the ends were very similar. It was better would not call it great. Still overall good game, still looked good late 2017 when I played through them again although ME1 was rough.

ME2 still the best

Nope. Free DLC just added the “pass” ending, the end montage, and the scene of the Normandy picking up a crew member.

 

[Jester David]

From a narrative point of view a Pyrrhic victory is not satisfactory.

Disagree.
If there wasn’t a high cost to stop a million year cycle of extensions it would have felt too easy. We didn’t need a shallow Hollywood ending where they turn the Reapers off and everyone has a party.

But if you liked it, that's cool. But the criticisms of ME3s ending are well founded in my opinion.

Which comes access as “I didn’t like it, therefore it’s terrible”.

You’re allowed to just not like something.
You don’t have to convince other people it’s bad or prove tha it’s secretly terrible. You can just say you didn’t like it.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Disagree.
If there wasn’t a high cost to stop a million year cycle of extensions it would have felt too easy. We didn’t need a shallow Hollywood ending where they turn the Reapers off and everyone has a party.

Control and Synthesis don't really require any sacrifices, however.
The Destroy sacrifice isn't even that big if you already eradicated the Geth. And even if you didn't - them, it are just some machines.
The only good part of that sacrifice is that it involved Shepard. Except that is the one that you can actually undo (and only in the Destroy Ending).

The real sacrifice should have been Humanity. Worst Case (aka Suicide Mission where everyone, including Shepard, dies), all of it, best case, significant parts of Earth. There is even a good story reason for it, the super-weapon is in Earth Orbit, and probably the highest concentration of Reaper forces as well. And in any but the worst case ending, humanity can still make it, just severely diminished and struggling - but with the respect of all the Citadel species who know what humanity sacrificed to save all of them. And regardless of whether you take the original endings or this alternate new ending - Earth is bound to be pretty fracked after what happened in ME3. So the restoration of Earth or rebuilding humanity would be a legitimate story in any sequel. But the Green, Blue and Red endings are so different that any attempt to make a successor involving all 3 is bound to fail.

 

[carolpegram]

Copies sold is an important metric. However, it's not the only one. Here is an article about 15 different metrics game companies like EA use: https://uk.edubirdie.com/ Here's another article about metrics that less relevant to Anthem, but has a great bit at the beginning about different type of loyalty, and how loyalty is not the same as happiness: https://medium.com/@devtodev/25-key-metrics-that-track-user-loyalty-in-games-db8414c7a6ac

The link I shared in my previous post doesn't measure any of these, but it shows EA's response. It's the aggregate of all the metrics EA is looking at.

Thanks for these articles. I loved the first one. It gives pretty interesting insights on game metrics and how companies measure them.

 

[Zardnaar]

Control and Synthesis don't really require any sacrifices, however.
The Destroy sacrifice isn't even that big if you already eradicated the Geth. And even if you didn't - them, it are just some machines.
The only good part of that sacrifice is that it involved Shepard. Except that is the one that you can actually undo (and only in the Destroy Ending).

The real sacrifice should have been Humanity. Worst Case (aka Suicide Mission where everyone, including Shepard, dies), all of it, best case, significant parts of Earth. There is even a good story reason for it, the super-weapon is in Earth Orbit, and probably the highest concentration of Reaper forces as well. And in any but the worst case ending, humanity can still make it, just severely diminished and struggling - but with the respect of all the Citadel species who know what humanity sacrificed to save all of them. And regardless of whether you take the original endings or this alternate new ending - Earth is bound to be pretty fracked after what happened in ME3. So the restoration of Earth or rebuilding humanity would be a legitimate story in any sequel. But the Green, Blue and Red endings are so different that any attempt to make a successor involving all 3 is bound to fail.

Its why you make one of them canon if you have a direct sequel. KoToR for example the light side ending is the canon one.

 

[Jester David]

Its why you make one of them canon if you have a direct sequel. KoToR for example the light side ending is the canon one.

If you think the reaction to ME3 was bad... try telling fans that one ending was the “right” one BioWare would have had death threats...

 

[Zardnaar]

If you think the reaction to ME3 was bad... try telling fans that one ending was the “right” one BioWare would have had death threats...

Only if you do a direct sequal. ME4 time jump side steps it but that wasn't ME4s main problem. I tried it for 20 mins or so and gave up.