D&D 4E Fortune Telling in 4E

[bennyhobo]

So I'm getting ready to run a Ravenloft campaign, and I've been going back through the old AD&D Realm of Terror box set. I'm trying to adapt some of the old mechanics and details of that to 4E. There's one section of the sourcebook that talks about Gypsies, and gets into specifics of fortune telling. It even goes so far as to describe how you can assign meanings and details to a regular deck of cards for use in your game. That way the player can shuffle it and feel like they're having some control over the fate of their character.

Last year at Gencon I picked up a deck of cards from Slugfest Games called "Gambling? I'm in!". It's a sort of generic fantasy-themed deck of cards with a book detailing different games that can be played, and how to gamble with them. I wanted to build a scene where the players had to gamble for a piece of info, but it never worked out. My players wouldn't go the way I wanted them to (surprise). But now I think I can use the cards as a fortune telling tool, and it'll look better than just using a standard deck of cards.

So below here is a list of the different cards and the potential meanings I've assigned to the various details. I'm not using the whole deck, because I want a higher chance for the Dragon card to come up (the normal deck size is somewhere around 100 cards, and there are only 3 dragons total). I'm looking for comments on the meanings I've come up with, and suggestions on other ways to approach that stuff, if anyone has them? Also, I'm not sure what traits to use for the Raven and Hawk symbols. So any suggestions there would be welcome.

In the end, it'll be a lot of making it up on the spot for me. But I still want to have some kind of basic framework to start with. And of course it'll be prefaced with the gypsy saying that they have the chance to change their fate. This is merely one possible future.

Card Faces:
Warrior - Strength/Determination
Princess - Beauty/Deception
Bard - Charm/Travel
Merchant - Wealth/Power
Rogue - Independence/Adaptability
Dragon - Chaos

Colors:
Green - Earth
Blue - Water
Red - Fire

Animal Symbol:
Wolf - Cunning
Horse - Stability
Rabbit - Speed
Raven -
Owl - Perception
Hawk -

In the Deck:
6x Warrior (two each color)
6x Princess (two each color)
6x Bard (two each color)
6x Merchant (two each color)
6x Rogue (two each color)
3x Dragon (one each color)
33 total cards

Playing the cards:

Card 1 represents the core of the PC's character. It reveals details of their soul.
Cards 2 and 3 represent their future. These cards explain what fortunes and dangers await them, what they can accomplish and what consequences there will be if they fail. These cards are dealt on opposite sides of card 1.
Cards 4 and 5 are choices they will be faced with. Challenges are presented to everyone in their lives. These will be their greatest ones. These cards are dealt on the remaining two opposing sides of card 1.
Card 6 is their adversary. This represents the greatest foe that they will face in their lives. This card is laid on top of card 1.

Thoughts?

 

[Neubert]

I could see Raven being something akin to Intelligence or Wisdom. And it would be a nod to the 3.5 Raven familiar that was able to speak a single language.
Hawk is tough as it is also very perceptive. Even though Owls can see in the dark, they are also considered very wise, so your best bet might be to shuffle it around so Raven is Intelligence, Owl is Wisdom and Hawk is Perception (or similar descriptive names, I noticed you're not using stats/skills, but it was what came to mind - especially since there are 6 animals and 6 ability scores )

Edit:
I was wondering, why does the first card represent the core/soul of the character? The player probably has something in mind for his character, unless it is your intent that the first card may or may not be correct?

I like it though. Will you interpret the cards based on the plots you have in mind (so the fortune is likely to come to pass) or is it just for flavor (meaning a fortune saying that a character will face a choice between wealth and friends, will probably not happen, as you haven't planned it)?

 

[bennyhobo]

I like that, changing the Owl to wisdom. I think I'll do that. Then make the Hawk perception.

Yeah, I was trying to stay away from assigning specific stats to different details. I don't want it to be used to randomly generate the character's background. And I don't want it to determine how the game will flow. It's intended mainly for fun and flavor, and then I'll let the characters decide how much weight they want to place on it.

The order of the cards and what they represent and how they're laid out doesn't actually officially mean anything. It just felt like a cool-sounding way to explain the presentation. It's all made up, of course. I used to do palm readings when I was younger to hit on girls, and telling them in advance that there was some kind of "real" structure and meaning built into the process made them feel like I really knew what I was doing (I didn't). But I figure I can re-use some of those skills to draw the players deeper into the world.

So yeah, it's mainly just for flavor. It'll be in the first session of the whole campaign, so a lot is going to change, and I don't expect the predicitons to come true. But I'm going to try to use it as an opportunity to suggest different paths and goals. I also want to use it to establish that gypsies are an important faction in the land. It may even turn into a plot where they have to scare out a ring of cheating lying gypsies handing out false fortunes to hopeful travelers, or something. It all depends on how the players approach it.

P.S.

Seriously guys, palm reading. Chicks eat it up. Make sure you cut and clean your fingernails.

 

[Neubert]

Hehe, that is really cool.
If a character is very engaged in the fortune (either fully believing it is true or false), you could try to incorporate the fortune into the story. That will either solidify the character's opinion that fortunes are real, or make them consider changing their stance.
It would be awesome if you could get the player to keep coming back to have their fortune for the next adventure told!

In regards to the cheating, lying gypsies, maybe they claim they can change the traveller's bad fortune.. for a modest donation of course.

 

[MortalPlague]

You could also help fulfill the prophecy by giving the players some kind of 'story xp' when they make something happen according to the prophecy. Not necessarily xp, really; perhaps a "Fate Point", that they can spend to re-roll a die, or have events turn out in the favor, or have an NPC show up at an opportune moment...

 

[Nytmare]

I always really enjoyed Everway, it was basically a game where the primary mechanic to resolving pretty much any task was a tarot deck reading.

The Gambling I'm In deck doesn't lend itself to that kind of reading, but I think that the layout you have is kinda limiting. I think it might be better if it was more applicable to any kind of question or problem instead of just "what is the one, major, overriding prophecy attached to my character."

It's been a while since I played, but I think the basic reading in Everway was a 6 card triangle, where the position of the face up card (either right side up, or inverted) changed the possible interpretation of the card. So, for example, the card "Trickery" could mean that the character was going to be conned or double crossed, but if it was revealed upside down, it could mean that the character was going to discover the deceit in time to stop or recognize it.

The bottom three cards illustrated, in order, a problem from the characters past, present, and future. The second rank of cards represented the two forces (both positive and negative) working for and against the character. And the final, topmost card represented the overall fate and resolution of the question or problem.

 

[bennyhobo]

As much as I'd like to go out and buy a tarot deck, I'm pretty set on using the one I've got. You're right, it doesn't exactly lend itself directly to fortune telling. But I think I can make it work. It's still better than a regular deck of cards, and I already paid for it.

I do like your structure better than what I had. Past, Present, Future. Then positive and negative forces. Then the final statement. I think I'll switch to that. This way I can use it either to tell a fortune, or find the answer to a question. Giving the players that choice is a good idea. Keying into inverted cards had occurred to me, but I wasn't sure how best to decide when they were and weren't inverted, so laying it out in a triangle makes that work better.

Yeah, I definitely want to reward the players for dealing with this stuff in the game. Rather than introduce some kind of new mechanic, I'll probably just give them bonus XP, or extra action points, or maybe good loot. I might as well come right out and ask what would motivate them the most. I think that will help them get into it if they get to pick the type of reward.

The more I'm thinking about it, the better I like the idea of this being used to answer a question, rather than just tell a fortune. The PCs are also going to be cursed at this point. So it would be a good way for them to learn how to lift that curse. And that'll definitely drive the story.

 

[Neubert]

Raven could also be knowledge, if you're still looking for suggestions.

 

[bennyhobo]

Yeah, definitely still looking for ideas and suggestions. We're not going to play until mid-August, so I've got time.

 

[MortalPlague]

The PCs are also going to be cursed at this point. So it would be a good way for them to learn how to lift that curse. And that'll definitely drive the story.

Ah, the old 'we're all cursed' plot hook. I had a DM use that one a couple years back. Be careful how you introduce it though, that can have players rebelling against your story if you suddenly slap it on with no chance to avoid it. Best to have it happen naturally, or start the game with the PCs already cursed.