Gamma World - Disappointment

[Teflon Billy]

...This S&S version is better than the Alternity version though, I'll give it that.

I wanted to say the same thing. The SSS Version is leagues better than the "Alternity" one (though it wasn't really for Alternity, I know which one you mean. I own it)

 

[Darrin Drader]

Now this is just straight-up crazy talk Darrin

Scarred Lands boasts the work of William O'Connor, who is like unto a God (Albeit a God of RPG art, so his power base is somewhat nebulous)

Like most of what we've been discussing, I'm sure this comes down mostly to opinion. While I find the art in the Scarred Lands passable, I rarely find it exceptional. I like the setting, don't get me wrong, but the art just doesn't make me go "Wow!".

 

[Teflon Billy]

Like most of what we've been discussing, I'm sure this comes down mostly to opinion...

Of course it does man I was just ribbing you/praising O'connor

Objectively presented arguments about subjective art quality are sucker bets.

 

[Darrin Drader]

I wanted to say the same thing. The SSS Version is leagues better than the "Alternity" one (though it wasn't really for Alternity, I know which one you mean. I own it)

I must be the only one in the world that doesn't hate the Alternity version. I also own it. Of course it was written by Andy Collins and Jeff Grubb, both of whom I have an enormous amount of respect for... possibly so much respect that its coloring the way that I see that product. The other reason I like it is because the setting portion is set where I live. I catch the references that many may not and to me it seems like a great way to blow up Seattle.

Regardless, I like the D20 GW better than the Alternity one. There's just more there.

 

[thomden]

As you point out, every incarnation of Gamma World has been drastically different.

I didn't say that. As different as those versions were they were still recognizably Gamma World. This is not Gamma World, and it is easy to point out what IS Gamma World.

Also, like the book says, you can choose to set this later than the timeline they establish, thus reducing the amount of knowledge of the old world that remains.

Well, you can rewire ANY RPG, but I buy published RPG's so I don't have to. I expect the designers to do that work for me. Otherwise I'd just sit around and make my perfect RPG with the unlimited loads of free time I have. My point was Gamma World has always been Sci-fantasy. I don't see anything that suggests that in the book I'm reading.

Why in the world would I want yet another book redefining the core rules of the game?

Ick. I'm afraid you're reading quite a bit into my post. I'm quite happy with d20 Modern as the core rulebook. It is very cool, especially the clever solution to money which is always a problem in non-fantasy RPG's. What I expected was a lot more GAMMA WORLD specific goodness, particularly mutations and other character creation stuff. I think everyone did. Is there one person here who thinks the mutation and character creation section is well fleshed out? honestly.

Here is what I think happened. They looked at the sales numbers of d20 Modern, and realized Gamma World would not have nearly as large a customer base. So they diverted resources to other more lucrative projects (like the gorgeous Warcraft RPG). Gamma World didn't get much love. I mean Bruce may have done the best work in his career, I'm a huge fun of his stuff, I just don't think this Gamma World is a worthy addition to the Gamma World license.

Still, this is an opinion based on just reading the book. I'm going to get my gaming group together, we'll make some characters and run through a scenario or two. My opinion may completely change, after all it's the play that matters.

 

[thomden]

ac?

I must be the only one in the world that doesn't hate the Alternity version. I also own it. Of course it was written by Andy Collins and Jeff Grubb, both of whom I have an enormous amount of respect for...

That's interesting. I was so let down by the Alternity version it literally took me years before I'd buy a book by Andy Collins again.

He redeemed himself with the Epic level handbook. That's a tough challenge to make D&D work over 20th level. I almost didn't buy it because he authored it, but the reviews were so good and my friends raved about it I finally caved in.

 

[Richards]

Originally posted by Baraendur:

They modernized Gamma World and made something that is dark, gritty, violent, realistic, and is a worthy successor to the cheesy incarnations this game went through under TSR.

I actually liked the cheesiness of the first edition. It gave it character.

Johnathan

 

[Darrin Drader]

Well, you can rewire ANY RPG, but I buy published RPG's so I don't have to. I expect the designers to do that work for me. Otherwise I'd just sit around and make my perfect RPG with the unlimited loads of free time I have. My point was Gamma World has always been Sci-fantasy. I don't see anything that suggests that in the book I'm reading.

Other than the lack of sentient plants, I don't see how this part has changed much. Sure, it uses superscience to explain how things came to be, but that doesn't really change the setting other than to make it a bit more believable. I really wouldn't say that it was sci-fantasy in any edition though, since fantasy would imply magic, which has never been part of Gamma World. Besides, you really wouldn't have to rewire anything if you just wanted to use your old source material. The new rules would still fill the holes.

Ick. I'm afraid you're reading quite a bit into my post. I'm quite happy with d20 Modern as the core rulebook. It is very cool, especially the clever solution to money which is always a problem in non-fantasy RPG's. What I expected was a lot more GAMMA WORLD specific goodness, particularly mutations and other character creation stuff. I think everyone did. Is there one person here who thinks the mutation and character creation section is well fleshed out? honestly.

Again, why should this book get bogged down in character creation rules when D20 Modern already does that for you? Besides, they spent two chapters and an appendix on character creation. There's a section on how the different core classes interract with the world. There are new occupations, skills and feats. I think there's plenty here that will let anyone play the type of character they want. I just can't figure out what is supposedly missing here.

I think everyone did. Is there one person here who thinks the mutation and character creation section is well fleshed out? honestly.

I do agree that there should be more mutations. I guess I'm not as concerned about this since I also have Darwin's World and Omega World. Between the 3, there are mutations aplently. The real trick is making sure that they are balanced between the 3 sources. Yeah, a little rewiring, but its not so difficult to do.

Here is what I think happened. They looked at the sales numbers of d20 Modern, and realized Gamma World would not have nearly as large a customer base. So they diverted resources to other more lucrative projects (like the gorgeous Warcraft RPG). Gamma World didn't get much love. I mean Bruce may have done the best work in his career, I'm a huge fun of his stuff, I just don't think this Gamma World is a worthy addition to the Gamma World license.

If SSS didn't think this was going to be a successful property, they wouldn't have gone after the license in the first place. I don't think this has anything to do with the sales of D20 Modern, especially since it does include core classes that work with the D&D 3.5 rules, just in case the buyer doesn't have D20 Modern. I think what happened is that BB and Co. designed it the way that they thought it should be and followed that vision. I think left over technology in a PA setting is one of the cooler things you can do with it.

Still, this is an opinion based on just reading the book. I'm going to get my gaming group together, we'll make some characters and run through a scenario or two. My opinion may completely change, after all it's the play that matters.

I couldn't agree more with that statement. The fact that you are willing to sit down and play it despite your misgivings does say a lot. I think you may enjoy it a bit more if you pick up Terrors of Twisted Earth from RPG Objects and maybe look at some of the other Darwin's World books. Between the two sources you should be able to piece together exactly the game you want to play without a whole lot of extra effort.

 

[Teflon Billy]

I must be the only one in the world that doesn't hate the Alternity version. I also own it. Of course it was written by Andy Collins and Jeff Grubb, both of whom I have an enormous amount of respect for... possibly so much respect that its coloring the way that I see that product.

I love Jeff Grubb's work as much as anyone (probably more so where Al-Qadim is concerned), but IMO this treatment of the franchise is still not that great, so maybe you're right about the coloring (or maybe tastes just differ)

The other reason I like it is because the setting portion is set where I live. I catch the references that many may not and to me it seems like a great way to blow up Seattle.

Well, I'm from Vancouver, and I'll agree with you that this part of the product is pretty cool.

Regardless, I like the D20 GW better than the Alternity one. There's just more there.

Amen to that.

 

[Yellow Sign]

Again, why should this book get bogged down in character creation rules when D20 Modern already does that for you? Besides, they spent two chapters and an appendix on character creation.

Yeah, who wants alot of character creation rules in a Players Handbook!