Gelatinous Cube

[pvandyck]

During a recent combat, a gelatinous cube snuck up on us from behind, and cornered the only player who was in the back, the wizard. The thing slid over the top of him, and he failed his reflex save to get out of it's way. The rest of us were up in the front of the battle, and couldn't do much to help him. He made is save vs the paralyzation.

While this made for a funny and interesting turn of events, my DM then took an approach that I disagreed with. He determined that the wizard couldn't do ANYTHING. I disagreed, saying the MM states that the person is " considered grappled and trapped within the cube's body". He said, "Yeah, TRAPPED. The wizard can't do anything." I said, "No, GRAPPLED, to which he can try (against the massive size modifier of the cube) to get free".

I argued a couple more points:

1. The CR for a cube is 3. Doing what the DM was doing turned the monster into a save-or-die monster. Not correct.

2. Why would it say "grappled", for which there is a condition listed in the DMG and a whole set of rules about, if it really meant "screwed"?

3. Why would it also say, when the person is in the cube, that the person is "still subject to the paralyzation effects and must continue to save", if the person is already screwed (aka paralyzed) when inside the cube? I thought it was funny that the DM made him save vs paralysis another couple rounds, and when he failed it, said, "Okay, now you're paralyzed." I just kind of looked around the table and said, "and what's different now?"

I believe my DM made a mistake on the determination of the this monster.

Any thoughts?

Thelbar

 

[trespassers]

My thoughts are that your DM is always right.

Suck on THAT.

Oh wait, that's not what you wanted to hear, was it?

 

[Piratecat]

Your DM may always be right, but in this case I think he was less right. Or, in fact, wrong. As is Trespassers.

"Trapped" means that the PC is grappled inside of the cube instead of on its surface. The PC should continue to make grapple checks and saving throws as normal.

 

[trespassers]

hmm ...

i didn't mean to post that. i was just thinking out loud.

Bad, fingers!

 

[Marius]

hmm ...

i didn't mean to post that. i was just thinking out loud.

Bad, fingers!

Oh, I wouldnt back off that one at all. You can argue till you're blue in the face, but if your DM is steadfast on a point, then they are right. It says it like 50 times in the DMG that the DMs decision is the final arbiter of decisions, surpassing even the rules in the Core books. If you don't like it, you can stop playing, but your DM is the one that has to deal with the consqeuences of their decisions, and gelatinous cubes may be different in their world, that they have created for you to enjoy.

Essentially, it comes down to "Suck it up".

 

[trespassers]

Well, okay, i AM backing off, but only because i don't want the moderator to hate me ...

<spineless>

i mean, as far as the RULES are concerned, both Piratecat and the DM are correct.

Which is what he was saying.

But everyone knew that.

Shutting up now, sir.

 

[dcollins]

Any thoughts?

You were reading the rules correctly and your DM was making a bit of an error.

Now, I'd like to recommend that you take it easy on your DM in this case. DMs have to make real-time judgements and sometimes don't have complete rules mastery -- grappling in particular seems really confusing to a lot of people. It's actually not the worst ruling to speed things up and say the character's just helpless when the wizard probably wouldn't win a grapple against the cube in the first place.

Please, don't stop the game to argue chapter-and-verse with the DM. Sometimes you just need to accept how they're running the game and have a conversation about the preferred ruling after the fact.

The DM's not always right, but like a referee, you should play the game willing to accept both good calls and bad... (and also those based on special-case information you don't have available to you).

 

[Marius]

Re: Re: Gelatinous Cube

you should play the game willing to accept both good calls and bad... (and also those based on special-case information you don't have available to you).

Meaning, in essence, that the DM is always right on a rules dispute, as they are the ones who make the rules for their world.

 

[maddman75]

On DM rulings, I go by this philosophy. You can have a bit of time to make your point in-game, but then I'm going to make a on-the-spot ruling to keep things going. If you want to argue with me about it after the game, I'd be more than happy to, and could even reverse myself as far as future situations.

In your case, I'd at least argue that the Gelatinous Cube, played as your DM interprets the rules, should be a higher CR and therefore worth more XP.

 

[dcollins]

Re: Re: Re: Gelatinous Cube

Meaning, in essence, that the DM is always right on a rules dispute, as they are the ones who make the rules for their world.

Frankly, I don't agree with that. DM's, too, can say "yeah, I blew that call, I won't do it the same way next time". I have to do this myself from time to time. No one says "the referee is always right" in sporting events, and neither should they say the same about DMs.