Getting those potions out in combat: How long?

[Trainz]

Allow me to muddy the waters a bit more...

ENworlders:"NO ! NO PLEASE NOOOO ! ! !"

Oh come on, it'll be fun:

What if, before opening the door in a dungeon room in which PC's expect a monster to be in, the fighter pours in his mouth the contents of a cure serious wounds potion, but doesn't swallow it. He just holds it in his mouth. As soon as he opens the door, the fight starts, and the critter manages to hit him for 30 damage. The fighter swallows (an immediate action if there ever was one) and cures 3d8+5 HP.

How about that ?

 

[shilsen]

Allow me to muddy the waters a bit more...

ENworlders:"NO ! NO PLEASE NOOOO ! ! !"

Oh come on, it'll be fun:

What if, before opening the door in a dungeon room in which PC's expect a monster to be in, the fighter pours in his mouth the contents of a cure serious wounds potion, but doesn't swallow it. He just holds it in his mouth. As soon as he opens the door, the fight starts, and the critter manages to hit him for 30 damage. The fighter swallows (an immediate action if there ever was one) and cures 3d8+5 HP.

How about that ?

No problem. I think I'd rule that holding it in his mouth without swallowing it (don't forget a potion is just 1 ounce of liquid) would require concentration, just like a spellcaster uses on a spell, so it would take a standard action each round. And if someone hits him, he has to make a Concentration check to avoid swallowing it.

How about that ?

 

[Trainz]

No problem. I think I'd rule that holding it in his mouth without swallowing it (don't forget a potion is just 1 ounce of liquid) would require concentration, just like a spellcaster uses on a spell, so it would take a standard action each round. And if someone hits him, he has to make a Concentration check to avoid swallowing it.

How about that ?

That's a very sensible answer. You should have seen the ruccus this situation caused on RGFD 5 years ago (IIRC).

On dude argued that american natives used to run with pebbles in their mouth to train themselves. He thus argued that fighting is possible with an ounce of potion in the mouth. Of course, the sensible reply to this would be "fine, house-rule it in YOUR game".

 

[shilsen]

That's a very sensible answer. You should have seen the ruccus this situation caused on RGFD 5 years ago (IIRC).

On dude argued that american natives used to run with pebbles in their mouth to train themselves. He thus argued that fighting is possible with an ounce of potion in the mouth. Of course, the sensible reply to this would be "fine, house-rule it in YOUR game".

That's when you ask if the guy took the Native American Training regional feat. Though I like your sensible reply too

 

[HeavyG]

On dude argued that american natives used to run with pebbles in their mouth to train themselves. He thus argued that fighting is possible with an ounce of potion in the mouth. Of course, the sensible reply to this would be "fine, house-rule it in YOUR game".

It's amazing how often natives are used to justify weird rules.

You know, that's the kind of things I would allow once, if it happened at a dramatic moment. But not every combat, that would get old pretty quickly.

 

[Scion]

concentration check every round, not very hard but something (say dc10, dc 15 if running). beyond that, it cannot be put back into the bottle afterwards, so the potion is effectively used. along with still needing an action to drink it properly.

I dont see a problem really

 

[Liquidsabre]

Breathing only through your nose while fighting a melee combat I foresee some difficulties there for the character. A heavy hitting blow to the character possibly expelling breath suddenly may cause the potion to spew forth from the chaarcters mouth, losing the potion. Finally, as has already been mentioned, there is the possibility of swallowing the potion prematurely.

Considering these factors and mechanics to represent them all, there should be nothing wrong with a character making use of this tactic as much as they might want, though there will be both the chance to accidentally swallowing the potion, spitting it out, and a limited duration while fighting due to the havy amounts of oxygen needed to fight in melee combat - swinging a sword, dodging blows, taking hits, etc.

 

[Ninja-to]

Allow me to muddy the waters a bit more...

ENworlders:"NO ! NO PLEASE NOOOO ! ! !"

Oh come on, it'll be fun:

What if, before opening the door in a dungeon room in which PC's expect a monster to be in, the fighter pours in his mouth the contents of a cure serious wounds potion, but doesn't swallow it. He just holds it in his mouth. As soon as he opens the door, the fight starts, and the critter manages to hit him for 30 damage. The fighter swallows (an immediate action if there ever was one) and cures 3d8+5 HP.

How about that ?

You could rule in this case that a potion has been 'inbibed', as the mouth and pores inside begin absorbing the potion on contact whether he wants to or not, so the potion simply sinks into the being even if he doesn't swallow.

It makes sense on another level. What about the unconscious, downed character that has a cure light wounds poured on his mouth. Obvoiusly he's not swallowing, but the magic is taking effect by being poured into his mouth and being absorbed.

By the way I came back to this thread because I found an interesting quote in the PHB that I don't think anyone here has mentioned yet.

Page 142 : Draw or Sheathe a Weapon

Drawing a weapon so that you can use it in combat or putting it away so that you have a free hand, requires move action. THIS ACTION ALSO APPLIES TO WEAPONLIKE OBJECTS CARRIED IN EASY REACH SUCH AS WANDS...

I consider a potion/flask a weaponlike object, especially if it's flaming oil or the like (and since a wand is considered a weaponlike object it only makes sense), similar to what a hand grenade might be to retrieve. So I allow my players to retrieve a potion in easy reach as a move action combined with another move. I still rule that it provokes an AtOp because you're distracted with looking for the right potion etc. You still need a base attack bonus of +1 too.

Anyone disagree? Only minor problem is where is 'within easy reach' without using those funky potion belts (which we don't use).

 

[Rudar Dimble]

And what if you have the potion on your belt (from the FRCS, so it's a free action grabbing it)....would you still draw an AoO?

BTW: nice thread. It wasn't untill now that I realised my group has been handling potion all wrong for years now

 

[azmodean]

I still think that any society where there are beverages that can save your life would have invented the beer helmet. Just suck on that potion whenever you get thirsty. You could actually make it work legitimately and have it be safe and padded and stuff.

Actually Complete Adventurer has a hollow "potion tooth" that you can put one dose of a potion in and open the tooth as a free action. One of the handfull of usefull things in the book IMO.