D&D 5E Great news on Skills

[Imaro]

In a sense, 3e system was good, but i think it was a bad decision that the fighter only got 2 skillpoints per level and had so few class skills, so that any investments in skills like diplomacy and perception was too expensive...

Yep, this IMO, was the issue with the 3.x skill system, not the discrepancy between someone devoted to a skill far surpassing someone who doesn't (which I will note here is also a problem in 4e, even with auto-leveling).

 

[Plaguescarred]

I agree

 

[Ratskinner]

3e skill points more accurately model reality (in a very, very loose sort of way) but they were also a bad system that bogged down the game. Class skills, cross-class skills, multiply by four--all a mess.

Seconded. It seemed like such a lot of rules-weight, with so little gain. I prefer a much "lighter" treatment of skills, and 3.5 is why. I kinda like the idea of dropping the auto-advancement of skills, but keeping the simple "you know this" bonus. I wouldn't mind too much of there were some feats that let you up a skill bonus, so demonstrate a character truly becoming a master at the skill.

 

[GreyICE]

3e skill points more accurately model reality (in a very, very loose sort of way) but they were also a bad system that bogged down the game. Class skills, cross-class skills, multiply by four--all a mess.

This so very accurately describes much of 3E's design decisions.

10% accuracy increase for a 1000% complexity increase and with a dozen unintended consequences introduced besides.

As I've said before, one of the few things to recommend about 4E's bad skill system is that it was a marginal improvement on an EVEN WORSE system. Neither of them even approached realism in any way (3E by not acknowledging that as people adventured they'd naturally gain skills across the board, 4E by saying that everyone on the planet has an equal level of skill at everything they're skilled at (minus some pretty bad feats, and racial/background bonuses, which mainly served to allow min-maxing). One of them viciously attacked roleplay, one of them just said "roleplay? DM fiat go!" I mean it's straight up embarrassing when a system meant to differentiate characters and flesh them out outside of combat actually promotes a cookie cutter sameness. You have failed, do not pass go, do not collect $200.

Next could improve on both of them simply by not herpderping.

 

[Grimmjow]

at first i didnt really like how the skills were going to be changed. Now that they did it it looks way better. No more -1 on skill checks

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

Looking at the new skill list, I think it could be culled again in places.

Drive and Use Rope all seem like they should be cut right off the bat - too specific. Profession and Perform sound like they should be built into traits rather than being their own skills. I think Gather Rumors should go back to Streetwise so it can also cover navigating city streets and stuff like that.

A few skills could also be combined: Track and Search, Spot and Listen, and certainly Escape Artist and Use Rope all could be combined without losing much.

Why is Swim in there but not Jump?

Others are unclear in their mechanical application. When do you use the Heal skill? Is Tumble useful in combat? Can you use Escape Artist to help break a grapple? I like these skills but would appreciate seeing more details on how to apply them, especially for rogues (who after all focus so much on skills).

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

I think they're testing the waters here by presenting what is essentially the 3E skill list. I think it's too far a swing in the other direction. Not by a lot, but by some.

Perception (listen and spot)
Acrobatics (tumble and balance)
Mechanics (disable device and use rope)

These would go a long ways to cleaning things up. Also, I like Streetwise instead of Gather Rumors and Stealth instead of Sneak.

 

[Grimmjow]

if we're going to talk about what skills should be on the list i think they need to spread out the knowledge checks again.

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

if we're going to talk about what skills should be on the list i think they need to spread out the knowledge checks again.

I don't know. While I think I prefer the "Something Lore" presentation, the actual knowledge types as presented and described seem like a solid collection to me.

 

[justawhit]

Instead of Gather Information or Streetwise for a skill why not Reconnassaince? Rogues would be better at it within an urban environment while a ranger would be better in a wilderness setting. Recon could have numberous uses while the others are more narrow in focus.