Halving Hitpoints

[ignayshus]

We play it at normal hp, with the following modification:

1. If all the NPCs are bloodied then 2.
2. If no more than a third (rounded to nearest integer) of the PCs are bloodied then 4., else 3.
3. If there are more PCs than NPCs then 4., else nothing.
4. The PCs may use Intimidate.

The rule works both for PCs wanting to Intimidate and NPCs wanting to Intimidate.

 

[Quemaqua]

We play it at normal hp, with the following modification:

1. If all the NPCs are bloodied then 2.
2. If no more than a third (rounded to nearest integer) of the PCs are bloodied then 4., else 3.
3. If there are more PCs than NPCs then 4., else nothing.
4. The PCs may use Intimidate.

The rule works both for PCs wanting to Intimidate and NPCs wanting to Intimidate.

This is interesting to me. Kind of hearkens back to what Mustrum said earlier in the thread about having monsters flee and such. I find your formula interesting, and while I don't know that I feel the need to speed up combat every single time, it could prove very useful to have something like that on hand for a combat that *does* enter that space where it just drags on forever.

I also had another thought. Instead of just calling creatures "bloodied", you could call it "bleeding" for monsters of the natural/fleshy variety, and have them lose a small chunk of HP per turn after that point. No idea how that would work, but it seems like a logical method of speeding things up without instantly making the monsters weaker (that way a strong monster with some good attacks would still have the chance to get in some extra hits before it expires).

 

[Rhenny]

I really like keterys's idea, x2 to damage when bloodied. Very simple and it would make most creatures and PCs think about retreat or escape after being bloodied, a very natural response. This rule would make Strikers with sneak attack and or quarry bonus really powerful against bloodied, maybe too powerful.

As a result, I may try Mustrum_Ridcully's idea, imposing vulnerability (5 to heroic, 10 to paragon, and 15 to epic) to bloodied PCs and creatures.

Great ideas.

 

[keterys]

The vulnerability favors multiple attacks (minions, rangers, auras, conjurations, ongoing, etc), and I'm less in favor of that. Not really sure of a good fix - I was just going for "well, if you're halving hit points, maybe 3/4 (what the double after bloodied roughly equates to) and making it more fun / tactical"

If I ever did it, I'd probably make you die at -maxhp instead of -bloodied, though. Maybe I'll make some monsters that take double at bloodied but have healing abilities to see how things go in actual play.

 

[Asmor]

The vulnerability favors multiple attacks (minions, rangers, auras, conjurations, ongoing, etc), and I'm less in favor of that. Not really sure of a good fix - I was just going for "well, if you're halving hit points, maybe 3/4 (what the double after bloodied roughly equates to) and making it more fun / tactical"

Doubling damage after bloodied effectively reduces HP values to 3/4, while keeping the math simple to apply on the fly.

The more I think about it, the more I really like that solution.

So here's a question: it's implied that some people are applying their fix of choice to the monsters, some to both monsters and PCs, and some even to just PCs. What way do you prefer?

I think if I did the double damage while bloodied thing, I'd apply it equally to PCs and monsters. I like the dynamic where it suddenly becomes very dangerous to be bloodied, and it's more important to heal early and often...

 

[Rhenny]

I agree Asmor. Whatever affects creatures should affect PCs. I don't like making unilateral rules. It goes against my nature.

Cheers.

 

[WhatGravitas]

I like the dynamic where it suddenly becomes very dangerous to be bloodied, and it's more important to heal early and often...

The problem with this is that you need to adjust other effects to take this into account. There are some powers that only work while bloodied, like the fighter's Boundless Endurance. These powers get a lot weaker due to the smaller window you have.

Cheers, LT.

 

[Stalker0]

I agree Asmor. Whatever affects creatures should affect PCs. I don't like making unilateral rules. It goes against my nature.

Cheers.

In my opinion, PCs get bloodied way too often to use this against them. Monsters have a lot more hit points than players do, and while players do more damage, its not that much more.

As for the double damaged rule, I posted another thread about the idea, but didn't get any feedback.

Instead of doubling damage, I say apply a striker mechanic to it.

Bloodied Strike: Once per round, a PC can add 5 extra damage to an attack against a bloodied target, 10 at paragon, and 15 at epic.


This takes away the problem with multiple attacks, the math is simple and easy, and I believe it would accomplish a lot of what people are going for with the half hp idea. Further, it just makes players feel cool, who doesn't want to get to bust out some big damage once in a while?

 

[keterys]

In my opinion, PCs get bloodied way too often to use this against them. Monsters have a lot more hit points than players do, and while players do more damage, its not that much more.

I'd imagine that PCs get bloodied a _lot_ less often than monsters do and that they almost by definition have a better damage to hp ratio than monsters... after all, PCs win. Almost all the time.

As for the double damaged rule, I posted another thread about the idea, but didn't get any feedback.

Hmm, kinda wish forking a thread gave a link in the thread forked from... responded there. The double idea was off the cuff, and I do think your suggestion would work fine as another interesting method (I like it better than a vulnerability that works on every attack, certainly).

This takes away the problem with multiple attacks, the math is simple and easy, and I believe it would accomplish a lot of what people are going for with the half hp idea. Further, it just makes players feel cool, who doesn't want to get to bust out some big damage once in a while?

Yeah, I did suggest it partially as a way to make the fight shorter while still feeling "cool".

 

[catland93]

Another solution could be to maximise the power damage for bloodied creatures (only the power damage but not for special ability like warlock curse and sneak attack ecc).

And what do you think of a fixed critical range 18-20?