Healing Potions seem woeful

[Stogoe]

The Wheel of Time analogy was perfect, as is all of the healing present in Tolkien.

The Cure Disease ritual fits in well with this model, too.

 

[Henry]

And when you're out of healing surges and the healing potion doesn't work... Healing surges are such a bad, bad, bad, bad, bad, bad concept. Why did they pollute the game with this garbage?

Well, then, it means that the party has pushed on WAY, WAY further than it should have without resting - just like back in 1E, 2E, and 3E.

Your statement is based on the assumption that healing potions are for OUT of combat, rather than in combat. If a party fights on to the point where they're out of healing surges, and keeps going, then they're either very foolhardy, very brave, or a bit of both.

 

[Incenjucar]

And just because some people don't seem to get how healing and surges react... most things just tap your natural ability to recover an accelerate it, whether through adrenaline or cellular division.

But, at some point, you are out of adrenaline, and your cells are out of the energy and materials to divide.

It's like trying to get a heart to pump without blood.

 

[Boarstorm]

But, at some point, you are out of adrenaline, and your cells are out of the energy and materials to divide.

It's like trying to get a heart to pump without blood.

Which is why EVERY party needs a necromancer.

I thought class-dependency was going to be a thing of the past with 4E, but now this! It's a slap in the face!

 

[Vigilance]

Magic items as a whole, from what little I've seen, seem to have gotten the nerf-bat HARD in 4e.

And I for one, kind of like that.

The PCs should be winning the fights with their own abilities, not from the 80 magic items they're packing around in their portable hole.

 

[Ahglock]

Yes, I can. In fact, my 8th-level rogue was grateful to have a potion or two in our last battle.

.

How much gold to players have at 8th level?? And what is a 1,000GP in the world. Is gold the new copper, is a GP still about what a gp was in previous editions.

 

[Ahglock]

Exactly. The concept of a healing surge is just stupendously stupid. A magic potion can't heal you but take a nap and *bamf* you can spend a full day's healing surges and get back hundreds of HPs instantly. It's mindbogglingly stupid. Yes, it's a fantasy game, it's not supposed to be realistic, but theres fantasy and then there is sheer random drooling copy-a-video-game stupidity.

Tying it to minor actions was also grossly retarded. You think you could pull a potion out of a backpack and utilize it while wearing armor during the middle of combat as such a trivial action it has no consequences? Give me a bloody break. The convenience of video game macro palettes DOES NOT TRANSLATE to a PnP game. It is downright dumb. Whats going to be in the next splatbook, the ability for characters to wear 6 backpacks at the same time?

I can accept the gamist aspects of this, though yes it is incredibly wonky if you try to logically work it out. My issue is, healing surges limited by the day seem to set up the nova thing they were trying to avoid. I don't expect to see it much in the beginning, but in the beginning of 3e the nova thing wasn't happening much either. Give it a bit of time, and the healing surge based nova will be the complaint of the day.

 

[silentounce]

Is it fun inside that box?

Take your misplaced vitriol elsewhere. You have not got a valid reason that has been presented, just rage because it doesn't fit your pre-conceptions.

Healing now requires vital energy from the person being healed, short of particular abilities that directly call upon divine energy, which are then particularly taxing on the healer.

The Wheel of Time analogy was perfect, as is all of the healing present in Tolkien.

It is a much cleaner, less abuseable, more internally consistent system.

What's that saying about a pot and a kettle?

Anyway, I don't recall people falling asleep or resting for several hours and then being like brand new in those works of fiction.

That's what the guy you were replying to was talking about. Please explain why a healing potion doesn't work, yet sleeping for six hours does? It's the combination of those two ideas. Sleep heals all wounds? Ahh... nevermind, go ahead and blast away at my post. I'm sure you will regardless of whether I waste the time explaining it any better or not.

 

[Blackeagle]

Please explain why a healing potion doesn't work, yet sleeping for six hours does? It's the combination of those two ideas. Sleep heals all wounds?

Hit point damage does not necessarily represent physical wounds. It represents fatigue, luck, minor cuts and bruising, etc. After you've done a certain amount of fighting (expended your healing surges) no amount of magic is going to keep you going. A good night's rest gives you your energy back, gives the cuts a chance to scab over, etc.

 

[silentounce]

Hit point damage does not necessarily represent physical wounds. It represents fatigue, luck, minor cuts and bruising, etc. After you've done a certain amount of fighting (expended your healing surges) no amount of magic is going to keep you going. A good night's rest gives you your energy back, gives the cuts a chance to scab over, etc.

Yes, I understand this concept. HPs are an abstraction. Even more abstract in 4e than 3e. I still don't like it, and it seems a huge stretch even for a fantasy game. But that's just my opinion, and I know I'm not the only one that has it.