Help planning generalist fighter

[SnowDog]

Hi all --

My newest character (a human fighter named Jonan) is starting to take shape. I like to make things somewhat interesting, so even though I wanted to play a straight fighter, I didn't go the "normal" fighter route -- picking a feat chain and following it, specializing in a single weapon.

Instead, I wanted to make a generalist fighter who was comfortable with any weapon, who had a tactical understanding of the battlefield and was comfortable moving around to where his help would be most needed at any given time. I may eventually evolve him into something of a battlefield leader, though that's sort of up in the air.

To work towards this, I chose for my first 4 feats Mobility, Dodge, Combat Reflexes, and Quick Draw. The quick draw is key because he uses a weapon with reach when possible, and needs to quickly adapt to "normal" weapons when that isn't feasible any more (no spiked chains in this game).

He's just hit level 3, and I need to pick his level 3 feat. I'm looking towards the future, and I'm torn between Power Attack and Expertise. Both, I think, represent the good tactician's ability to focus his fighting in the direction he needs, and so both will fit the character concept well. Power Attack opens up Cleave, which I think would mesh really well with his current abilities. Likewise, Expertise opens up improved disarm and trip, which work well with a reach weapon.

(FYI Stats are: STR 17, DEX 14, CON 16, INT 13, WIS 10, CHA 12)

There will be some downtime in our campaign where the characters will be off-camera, and advance a level or two (we wanted to play the early time for the characters, and then move up to level 5 or 6). During that time, if there's a specific nonstandard feat I am interested in, he would consider it ... but I haven't found any I want. Likewise, if there's a prestige class I want, I should start focusing my feats/skills in that direction -- but I've seen none I want.

So -- given all that, does anyone have any advice? Anything I've overlooked? Nonstandard feats or prestige classes that I could submit to my DM for approval?

My current thoughts:

Take power attack. At level 4, increase STR to 18 and take Spring Attack. Try to reduce encumberance at this point so he can have a 30' move instead of the 20' he has now.

Future feats: Cleave, Expertise, Mounted Combat (?), ...?

Things I've considered but don't think they're worth it: add to a saving throw, improved initiative, two weapon fighting/ambidexterity....

It's unlikely this game will make it past, say, 10th level ... but anything's possible. But we're aiming more for a mid-level game. Keep that in mind when suggesting things; if the plan doesn't "come together" until level 14, it probably isn't worth looking into .

 

[phillipjp]

I have a similar concept for my Dwarven Fighter. I also wanted a generalist who could pick up and wield any weapon without prejudice, so I took no weapon specific feats. He's currently 7th, here are his feats:

Blind-Fighting
Dodge
Expertise
Improved Initiative
Iron Will
Lightning Reflexes
Quickdraw

My next fews feats will be:

Mobility
Power Attack
Cleave

 

[CRGreathouse]

Do you have MotW? Exotic Weapon Master looks right up your alley.

 

[Shallown]

I think Expertise or Power attack are the ways to go with a generalist.

The choice between the two I think depends more on your companions then anything else.

Expertise works great if you need to hold the line-delay the combat for spell catsers or others to get in position or cast spells. that AC boost and defensive fighting work great. My fighter/rogue has held off the enemy while the party ran with those fighting options. Also the Imp trip is excellent for the same reasons. You have Combat reflexes I find tripping people who move into my area of control as a great way opf controliing the combat. I use a spiked chain but a glaive or other reach weapon works just as well.

Power attack is useful when you have support from the begining and can afford to risk a miss or two to increase that damage and also leaning toward weapons with wider crit ranges also becomes useful.

Also as a generalist I would make sure I had a spiked gauntlet. Great for those attacks of oppurtunity when they pass your reach weapon but you haven't quickdrawed something else, also great when grappled.

Hope this helps.

 

[hong]

Take Weapon Focus in sword and bow, and Weapon Spec in the same. You can contribute both on the frontlines and from the second rank. Since you have Dodge and Mobility already, consider getting Spring Attack too.

 

[Jeremy]

I'm not sure 4 feats for +1 to hit/+2 to damage within 30 ft is a good move for a character that may be using a glaive just as often. Those feats are good if it is the weapon you are using 24/7 but 4 feats when you are guaranteed to be not getting the benefits at least 50% of the time (unless you can use a bow in one hand and a sword in the other ) is very expensive.

I think things like cleave or expert tactician for a free extra attack occasionally regardless of what weapon you are using might be better choices, IMVHO.

 

[phillcalle]

I like the idea of a generalist fighter. One thing that would be almost necessary would be a way to make life tough for a specialist fighter. I'd suggest Improved Disarm and/or Sunder+Improved Sunder. Suddenly that weapon master with improved critical, specialization, focus, etc...doesn't look so hot.

 

[Lord Ben]

Sunder would be cool if you can do lots of damage. Just break his weapon in two. What's his backup? A dagger? That feat is underused a lot. Improved disarm, Sunder, etc are nice if fighting lots of humanoids.

 

[hong]

I'm not sure 4 feats for +1 to hit/+2 to damage within 30 ft is a good move for a character that may be using a glaive just as often. Those feats are good if it is the weapon you are using 24/7 but 4 feats when you are guaranteed to be not getting the benefits at least 50% of the time (unless you can use a bow in one hand and a sword in the other ) is very expensive.

A fighter has feats to burn....

By 20th level, a human fighter has 19 feats, of which 11 are from his class. And even a generalist fighter isn't going to be carrying every weapon in the PHB; he'll probably stick to a couple, or maybe three -- a melee weapon, a ranged weapon, and a backup. Being a "generalist" basically means that he isn't specialised to such a degree that when he's out of his niche, he's severely hurt.

Here's a feat progression using PHB feats only that could would prove useful in nearly any situation:

• Dodge
• Mobility
• Power Attack
• Cleave
• Weapon Focus (melee weapon)
• Weapon Focus (ranged weapon)
• Weapon Spec (melee)
• Weapon Spec (ranged)
• Expertise
• Spring Attack
• Great Cleave
• Leadership (since the OP wants to be a leader of sorts)
• Mounted Combat
• Ride-By Attack
• Spirited Charge
• Iron Will
• Great Fortitude (these two are to stop those pesky save-or-die spells)

... plus two more, to round out the list. You could get Improved Crit with a melee and ranged weapon, but that might be going too far down the "specialist" road.

 

[Jeremy]

Very true hong. But for the good part of the time you are playing the character 1-10th level, he doesn't have that many feats. A lot of the utility in that progression doesn't come into play until the last 5 or 6 levels of the characters play. You generally want to take feats in an order that both qualifies you for whatever path you are aiming for and works your feats in an order you get use of them when they are fun. For example, gaining improved trip at 13th level might not be so good, because by that time when you are fighting classed fire giants, hydras, and any number of things much stronger than you, you've got little chance left to trip them. Just my opinion though. I'm known to be picky or wrong or both.

Heh. Problem with sunder of course is, unless your mage or cleric is throwing around greater magic weapons on all your blades (well, actually, maybe even if he is), the specialist fighter will tend to have a higher enhancement bonus on his weapon than on your typical weapon. Because he's only got the one weapon he's focused on.

However, grappling and beating him into the dirt with armor spikes used as light weapons, or disarming him and finding someway to appropriate his weapon, maybe an ally with readied action or a mage hand spell.