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Helping a friend who's frustrated over using Diplomacy.
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<blockquote data-quote="Starfox" data-source="post: 6132159" data-attributes="member: 2303"><p>Diplomacy has two functions:</p><p></p><p>A - Improve attitude. This always works, it does not need any kind of reciprocity. It changes how the creature feels about you, warming it up to talk to you and not eat you.</p><p></p><p>B - Specific suggestions and negotiation. This is where <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /><img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /><img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" />-for-tat negotiation comes in.</p><p></p><p>As noted above, both take a minute of game time - not necessarily a minute of real time, forcing the player to do a 1-minute solo performance is to limit the Diplomacy skill only to the actors and speakers among your players. There is a massive -10 penalty to do this in one round, but with a Diplomacy of +29, she has a good chance of succeeding even at -10. It does require that the rest of the party play along, tough, and not simply attack everything.</p><p></p><p>In most cases, it is the first function you want to use, just to get the monster talking and explain its agenda to you. After you know what the monster want, you can make an informed decision of whether to fight or negotiate further. Maybe you as a DM need to give your monsters more of an agenda beyond "eat the party", so that they have a reason to engage in A above, presenting the party with what they want.</p><p></p><p>A problem with very high Diplomacy scores (the "diplomancer" build) is that by RAW, any encounter with an intelligent creature not immune to charm can be turned into a social encounter. If you have a Diplomacy of +50 (yes, it is doable), you can make any creature you can talk to automatically become your friend in one round. This is not a good idea for a balanced game, as it makes the diplomancer dominate the action completely. The player must accept that some creatures are here to kill you, not to talk. If the DM reciprocates by making some encounters have an agenda and begin by making demands rather than attacking, thus initiating a social scene, the diplomacy player is usually satisfied with that.</p><p></p><p>In short, every player needs to have their moment in the spotlight. For a diplomacy character, this requires chances to talk and negotiate. They must also accept that the fighting characters want some of the spotlight too, so not all fights can be avoided.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Starfox, post: 6132159, member: 2303"] Diplomacy has two functions: A - Improve attitude. This always works, it does not need any kind of reciprocity. It changes how the creature feels about you, warming it up to talk to you and not eat you. B - Specific suggestions and negotiation. This is where :):):)-for-tat negotiation comes in. As noted above, both take a minute of game time - not necessarily a minute of real time, forcing the player to do a 1-minute solo performance is to limit the Diplomacy skill only to the actors and speakers among your players. There is a massive -10 penalty to do this in one round, but with a Diplomacy of +29, she has a good chance of succeeding even at -10. It does require that the rest of the party play along, tough, and not simply attack everything. In most cases, it is the first function you want to use, just to get the monster talking and explain its agenda to you. After you know what the monster want, you can make an informed decision of whether to fight or negotiate further. Maybe you as a DM need to give your monsters more of an agenda beyond "eat the party", so that they have a reason to engage in A above, presenting the party with what they want. A problem with very high Diplomacy scores (the "diplomancer" build) is that by RAW, any encounter with an intelligent creature not immune to charm can be turned into a social encounter. If you have a Diplomacy of +50 (yes, it is doable), you can make any creature you can talk to automatically become your friend in one round. This is not a good idea for a balanced game, as it makes the diplomancer dominate the action completely. The player must accept that some creatures are here to kill you, not to talk. If the DM reciprocates by making some encounters have an agenda and begin by making demands rather than attacking, thus initiating a social scene, the diplomacy player is usually satisfied with that. In short, every player needs to have their moment in the spotlight. For a diplomacy character, this requires chances to talk and negotiate. They must also accept that the fighting characters want some of the spotlight too, so not all fights can be avoided. [/QUOTE]
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