Level Up (A5E) Hit Dice for Exertion Points: Should be immediately Available. Temporarily.

[gamemasterbob]

Maneuvers in LUA5e are fun and make for great tactical choices. I want to use them and use them often. So, there should be a way to buy more EP and use it NOW. With limits! The rule as it is, is OK except that you have to wait one minute to use the EP you just got. By then the combat is probably going to be over. So I modify the rule this way

Temporary EP or TEP
You can only buy TEP with HD if your EP pool is empty. You can spend a max of 2 HD for TEP (1d4 per HD). Any TEP generated that exceeds your current max pool is ignored. TEP is immediately available.
After the encounter, any unspent TEP is lost and does not add to your pool. Acquiring TEP can be done once per encounter.

I think this idea keeps combat in balance and makes generating EP outside of a rest a costly choice. Especially at low levels. Also, you can use it immediately -You have to! This works better for me.

 

[Anselm]

I like this idea. Would you have it cost a bonus action or anything similar to activate? I'd probably allow a PC to gain TEP if they had one left as well to avoid a situation where they just can't spend their last one if they had only 2 exertion maneuvers or something.

 

[Larnievc]

I’d keep it simple and say you just spend the HD and be done with it.

 

[gamemasterbob]

No action, it's free. But whatever works for you. like Larnievc said “… keep it simple “ and intuitive. I tried to write the rule that way. The kind of rule you don’t have to look up twice.
I’m glad you like it - Happy Gaming.

 

[lichmaster]

I understand the intent of the idea but personally wouldn't implement it like this for a couple of reasons (here presented just as points for a constructive discussion, I really don't mean to crap on your idea, if it works well for your group go for it!):

1) At low levels, sacrificing 1 hd for exertion is very expensive. Especially since PCs cannot have more than 4 exertion (2x proficiency)
2) At high levels it becomes way too cheap instead, as PCs have plenty of HD and they just need to spend a couple of those to completely replenish their exertion. PCs could go nova many times in a day
3) Depending on the party, it can greatly incentivate players to go nova and then find ways to take a full rest to get those precious HD back

I'd like my players to occasionally get extra exertion, especially if it makes the scene feel more heroic.
One way I'd do this is by spending inspiration to regain some exertion (maybe half of their max pool). This should incentivate roleplaying and leaning into backgrounds/destinies to obtain inspiration, and then eventually funneling it into exertion. Or could be something that I award in particularly story critical moments.

Alternatively there could be a potion that restores 1d4 exertion. In a magic heavy setting this could be a relatively common item, and could make for an action heavy campaing.

 

[Anselm]

I understand the intent of the idea but personally wouldn't implement it like this for a couple of reasons (here presented just as points for a constructive discussion, I really don't mean to crap on your idea, if it works well for your group go for it!):

1) At low levels, sacrificing 1 hd for exertion is very expensive. Especially since PCs cannot have more than 4 exertion (2x proficiency)
2) At high levels it becomes way too cheap instead, as PCs have plenty of HD and they just need to spend a couple of those to completely replenish their exertion. PCs could go nova many times in a day
3) Depending on the party, it can greatly incentivate players to go nova and then find ways to take a full rest to get those precious HD back

I'd like my players to occasionally get extra exertion, especially if it makes the scene feel more heroic.
One way I'd do this is by spending inspiration to regain some exertion (maybe half of their max pool). This should incentivate roleplaying and leaning into backgrounds/destinies to obtain inspiration, and then eventually funneling it into exertion. Or could be something that I award in particularly story critical moments.

Alternatively there could be a potion that restores 1d4 exertion. In a magic heavy setting this could be a relatively common item, and could make for an action heavy campaing.

You can already spend hd to get more exertion. What the op is proposing Isa way to do so in combat with the risk that if you don't use the exertion, it goes away.

"Alternatively, you can meditate, refocus, and
stretch to refill your exertion pool more quickly. You
expend Hit Dice to do so, recovering 1d4 exertion
points for each Hit Die expended. The process takes
1 minute per expended Hit Die."
Pg457

 

[lichmaster]

You can already spend hd to get more exertion. What the op is proposing Isa way to do so in combat with the risk that if you don't use the exertion, it goes away.

"Alternatively, you can meditate, refocus, and
stretch to refill your exertion pool more quickly. You
expend Hit Dice to do so, recovering 1d4 exertion
points for each Hit Die expended. The process takes
1 minute per expended Hit Die."
Pg457

Exactly. My consideration for it being very expensive at low levels and probably too cheap at higher levels still stands, I'll have to make some experience as a LU Narrator to actually gauge it with real play. But at least this requires 1 minute per HD, which makes it relatively impossible to recover exertion in combat and potentially double your max exertion for a single encounter.

RAW you also recover your entire exertion with a short or long rest without spending HD, which is a much better deal for everyone and probably negates most of the need for this weirdly balanced bargain, assuming PCs can rest after an encounter that significantly depleted their resources.

If I wanted a very heroic combat, maybe against the BBEG, I'd rather allow them to gain and spend inspiration to recover half their exertion or use a one time magic item specifically designed to do so.

 

[Anselm]

Exactly. My consideration for it being very expensive at low levels and probably too cheap at higher levels still stands, I'll have to make some experience as a LU Narrator to actually gauge it with real play. But at least this requires 1 minute per HD, which makes it relatively impossible to recover exertion in combat and potentially double your max exertion for a single encounter.

RAW you also recover your entire exertion with a short or long rest without spending HD, which is a much better deal for everyone and probably negates most of the need for this weirdly balanced bargain, assuming PCs can rest after an encounter that significantly depleted their resources.

If I wanted a very heroic combat, maybe against the BBEG, I'd rather allow them to gain and spend inspiration to recover half their exertion or use a one time magic item specifically designed to do so.

Hmm I guess I'm confused about what you're responding to. Is it op's suggestion or the rules as they're written?

It sounds like you're worried about the ability to get exertion back at all between rests, rather than the suggestion in the post?

 

[lichmaster]

Hmm I guess I'm confused about what you're responding to. Is it op's suggestion or the rules as they're written?

It sounds like you're worried about the ability to get exertion back at all between rests, rather than the suggestion in the post?

A bit of both, actually.

Spending 1 HD to get 1d4 exertion IMO is a very expensive bargain at low levels, and very cheap at higher ones.
But at least requiring at least 1 minute per HD (RAW) makes it impossible to practically double your exertion expenditure in a single fight (most likely breaking most combat design assumptions).

In case I wanted my party to have extra exertion, I'd want to have more control on that and make it more occasional, thus the inspiration/plot requirement or the magic item.

 

[WarDriveWorley]

My biggest worry is that there are a few class features that do something similar (Adept's Focus Feature Battle Meditation (Desc: As an action, you can spend 1 hit die to regain 1d4 exertion. You can’t use this feature again until you finish a short or long rest. AG Page: 111) as an example). While I know that they can exist side by side I always worry about a universal use ability overshadowing a class feature. That said I've been toying with the idea of allowing my characters to voluntarily gain fatigue (only 1 level per use, 1d4 per level gained) during combat as a way to show they're pushing themselves past their limits.