D&D 5E [Houserule] An Alternative Bless and Guidance

[The Crimson Binome]

What do you think is the main weakness. Bonus is too spell, duration is too short, simple fact of having to burn a spell slot period?

The magnitude of the effect is too small, compared to the spell slot cost.

If you have a bonus of +1, then that will only change one-in-twenty failures into a success, and it's fairly unlikely that the party will fail twenty skill checks over the course of an hour. Even if they do, randomly converting one failure into a success is fairly insignificant, because it's random and you've already accounted for nineteen other failures going unmitigated. (That is to say, the skill check which was converted from failure to success was probably not a very important one.)

I feel like it would start to even out if you increased the bonus to +3. Even then, the spell slot cost would prevent them from using it on every single skill check.

 

[MechaTarrasque]

Maybe for guidance, keep it a cantrip with concentration, and make it:

You touch one willing creature. For the duration of the spell, the creature uses your wisdom modifier for making wisdom-based ability checks unless the creature's wisdom modifier is higher than yours.


Potentially the target gets more benefit, but for fewer skills. Since the effect doesn't end the first time you use it and still requires concentration, the spell won't be spammed as much.

 

[Blue]

Bless

You have a +3 proficiency bonus to all attacks and saving throws. This does not stack with normal proficiency bonuses.

--So what this does is make bless give a powerful and consistent bonus but one that tapers with time. For first level characters, this is a solid buff. For 5th level ones (once everyone has +3 proficiencies), this allows you to shore up your saving throw weaknesses (or attack rolls if you happen to use a weird weapon). But it doesn't stack and just give you "moar powwa!". Its still very useful, but not as outright powerful as before...and no extra rolling needed.

No extra rolling, but loads more fiddliness and math. In the two games I'm in there are at least one person per game that needs to be coached through the math for every roll, even when it's written on their character sheet.

This spell now gives three different cases that are not obvious to that type of player:

I don't have a proficiency, so I need to add +3.
I have proficiency, but it's only +2 so I need to add +1.
I have proficiency, and it's already at +3 so it doesn't do anything.

From the wording "You", you may have made this a self only spell instead of three targets. If that's the case the math part should be okay (since players who chose spellcasters are often more knowledable about mechanics) but if so that's a huge debuff from 3+ targets fo chocie to self.

I'd much rather have something that adds regardless. And in that case, the reminder of a "bless d4" put in front of the player is just as useful as a "bardic inspiration d8".

 

[5ekyu]

Bias - I dont have problems with Guidance or Bless as is in my games.

Changes to Guidance - I doubt you would ever see anyone spend a slot at any time slots matter at all for +1 to skills. Its just not worth it. It looks like you try and justify it with adding more targets, more time, no concen etc but the 1 in 20 chance it matters to the result is just not going to be worth a slot. You go from a cantrip casters want to take with their small number of cantrips to a spell that, well, would *you* choose to prep this as one of your limited number of spell slots?

If you want to hang more ribbons on your new guidance hoping somebody will cast it and prove you were right, make it a ritual. Thrn *maybe* somebody will spend time on it.

Of course, one could just raise casting time of the cantrip to "10m as a ritual)*

On Bless, this one I dont get the why behind. Burning concentration for d4s seems like a decent trade, but for low-side only +3 with de facto no gains to the high end. Seems like a trap spell after 5th. Do we need to take sprlls thst right now remain useful and turn more into spells that time out as you level?

If the issue is a personal dislike for d4, set it at +3 or +2 no rolls needed.

These spells both tend to make my selections for PC choices now. Both would ho awsy and not be chosen with these versions. Just ban them.

 

[DND_Reborn]

I set the bonus of both spells to a flat +2.

Ditto.

For Bless, no rolling an extra die and slowing things down.

For Guidance, we have been using a straight +2, but keeping it a cantrip and removing the concentration requirement. Each character can only receive it once until they take either a Short or Long Rest.

To the OP, your house-rules work fine, too IMO.

 

[Satyrn]

What do you think is the main weakness. Bonus is too spell, duration is too short, simple fact of having to burn a spell slot period?

The bonus is definitely too small, yeah.

As a player, I'd just be feeling that the spell's gonna have a real effect on only 1 out of every 20 rolls - because the only time +1 matters is when the DC is missed by 1. Like, the whole party's gonna have to make dozens of checks before I'd get the feeling of triumph that a successful command would provide (or the satisfying agony when command, is saved against).

I'm thinking there's no way the spell will have enough impact to enjoy, and so I'd just never bother preparing it.

(FYI: I'm definitely burned out on "collecting" all the little +1s that the last couple editions trafficked in. YMMV)

 

[Staffan]

If I felt guidance was out of hand, I'd change it to something like this:

Guidance
Divination cantrip
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Touch
Components: V, S
Duration: 10 minutes

You touch one willing creature. Once before the spell ends, the target can roll a d4 and add the number rolled to one ability check of its choice. It can roll the die before or after making the ability check. The spell then ends, and the target can't be affected by another casting of this spell until they have finished a long rest.

When you reach 5th level, instead the target can't be affected by another casting of this spell until they have finished a short rest.

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The main problem I see with guidance is that it steps on the bard's toes. Sure, 1d4 is less than even the lowest-level bardic inspiration, and it only applies to ability checks, but unlike bardic inspiration it is unlimited. That means that a party with a cleric with guidance will essentially make every prepared ability check at +1d4, and I can see how that could be problematic. At this point I don't feel the need to change anything (it hasn't been a problem IMC), but if I did the change would look something like this.