How should i do low Magic: Some ideas

[Albert_Fish]

Well we are currently running a high fantasy Epic level Campaign ( its not going well, with this much power the players think they can smash anything so never ever try to parlay, no matter how much i hint and outright tell them to). To Alleviate the stress of watching the players complain htat Plot Devices are not openly labeled as such and monsters whould not have levels so they can kill them easier i have decided the next campaign will be low magic.

But how do i approach low magic? And how do i make magic using classes ( after being weakened) appealing?

I have been thinking about Being very strict on memorization, researching new spells, studying spells and Components requiring players to keep a list of stuff and times.
This has the benefit of keeping players honest, adding a few short side adventures to get material components, finding training, and spending time developing new spells.
But this also barely weakens the Spellcasting classes and i would prefer for this to be low magic.

The idea of Spell fatigue has crossed my mind. 0-level spells cost 1 Subdual hitpoint, 1-level spells cost two, and so on until 9th level spells cost 18 subdual points.

This limits the number of spells a spellcaster might cast in a day without limiting the choices/number of spells
But it allows for the same level progression in spell power/efficacy and thus will probably not lower the instances of magic using PCs

A Spell Focus ( wand Stave Rod) that costs the character in temporary Ability points has its perks.
But again i dont think it would limit the spells the way i want.

i have toyed with the idea of limiting spells/day to around half of normal.
This slows spell progression but it means i have to make up for it in some way i.e. giving mages more HP, Clerics more feats, etc thus it means i have to re-balance the classes. This is undesirable because i am Lazy.

Does anyone else have anyother ideas? Can anyone expand on the ideas i have already stumbled across? What has worked for other low-magic campaigns?

 

[SylverFlame]

One thing that worked for me when I ran a low-level in 2e was increasing spell requirements for level.

that is, take the normal mechanic for determining a spells level (like when you research a new spell) and make all level 3 spells conform to the level 1 requirement. This makes spells less powerful and would explain a lack of wizards. Problem with this is that wizards quickly get trounced by anything and everything. Nothing is more ignominous than a L2 wiz getting eaten by two goblins.

A trick that will balance play is to simply limit the number of wizards and magic items you give characters. Cheap, but effective. So, when you hand out magic items you give players one +1 sword rather than three magic items. And you only let one wizard in your group.

If you want, you can eliminate all of the magic classes except for one (I suggest keeping wizard and axing all the others). This limits magic and keeps the old-guy-in-the-tower thing going. Also, increase costs of item creation feats so that not as many people can have them. Either make them cost 2 feat slots or increase creation costs. Explains why there aren't that many magic items out there.

Also, this is very important. Any magic monsters (dragons, elves, etc.) are VERY rare. In the case of dragons, there would be only a few (like 10) and alll of them are "creatures of legends" that haven't been seen in millenium.

The trick is play all of that up and make magic a wonderous thing worthy of five minutes description in game.

IMHO, avoid the whole mob out to kill the wizard thing. In a world where magic is rare the people probably never experienced. Unless you go with the idea that people rebelled and killed all the wizards (as in Dragonlance) and that is why it's low magic, then the torch wielding mob doesn't fit the "what was that?" style.

Oh, another thing I just remembered is use charges and "down-time" A LOT. If an item is only good for so long, or so often, it shows the building power that is required in low magic.

 

[kengar]

OK, so somehow you were reading my brain and typed up my post before I did.

I am facing the same basic issues and was reading the boards for ideas too.

Here are a couple of the ideas I was kicking around (DISCLAIMER: I haven't really fleshed them out too much yet, so further examination may prove them dippy.)

Spellcasters level at a slower rate like high power races (Drow, etc.): Level +1, etc.

Greatly reducing available magic items. Also limit PC item creation feats to limited use items like potions and scrolls.

Like you, I thought about spell components, limiting cost/availability and making the players track them more closely. I am afraid of bogging down in too much book-keeping, though.

No Sorcerers or Bards. I thought the automatically learning spells each level and spontaneously casting might be too much.

Eliminating the automatic known spell gain for wizards. Have them spend time and money in research (assuming adequete research facilities are available) or have them adventure looking for new spells. It would make finding a 3rd level scroll a much bigger deal!

One thought I had was for a hybrid sorcerer/wizard; one who didn't need to memorize spells each day, but needed to "book learn" them and have them in a spellbook for reference.

Divine spellcasters I thought might be limited to ONLY domain spells or spells within their deity's domains. Possibly with a few "universal" spells too.

I don't know. These are just a few ideas more or less off the top of my head.

 

[willpax]

One suggestion they had on the Middle Earth d20 project was to require all spellcasters to multiclass, with no more than half their levels in a spell casting class. That would make the effective caster level of anyone only 10th level, with repurcussions for the entire "magical economy."

That is probably the least drastic change I have heard of. I simply created a new magic system. I don't recommend that change unless you have way too much time on your hands.

 

[Kevin O'Reilly]

A real eaysy way is to make all spell components rare and expensive.

Next, remove the ability to copy spells. Spell books must be found.. hence alll that adventuring by Wizards.

Spell fatigue - as you pointed out - We allow the Wizard a spellcraft roll first to avoid hit point loss. DC=15+2*level. Further, if the roll is failed by 5 or more the Wizard is fatigued, if failed by 10 or more, exhausted.

As a combination these create a low-level magic feel.

One final thing, you have to make some similiar changes to clerical magics

 

[Jeph]

Suggestion: use d20 modern classes. Allows for more customization of characters, and keeps magic open, but only at slightly higher levels, and only up to 5th level spells. Add in a few extra talents (like Sneak Attack and some init + for Fast Hero, more skillz stuff for Smart, etcetera) to make the classes even more customizable, and viola, a nice bunch of diverse heroes, who can use magic if they work for it.

 

[Plane Sailing]

If I was starting a new low-magic campaign, I'd probably use the d20Modern rules as a basis.

If I was going to stick with D&D rules, then I'd have a campaign setting where the creation of magical items, potions, scrolls etc. was a lost art - none of the item creation feats are available. The only magical items that exist are leftovers from an ancient "golden age of magic".

I run a fairly low-magic campaign, and you need to be cautious about using creatures with DR - their effective CR will be higher than the MM lists, since that rather assumes default magic levels.

Cheers

 

[Darklone]

There have been several similar discussions at the Kalamar board about this matter. Some ideas (will repeat some mentioned above already) we came up with:

- Spellcasters have to multiclass and spellcasting class may never be the single highest class.
- Spellcasting classes are only available as Prestige Classes.
- Skip spells for new levels for wizards. Hand out few magic items and let sorcerers only learn spells from someone who shows them (for a price).
- Use different magic systems.
- Make all priests Expert/bards, skip the cleric class...
- Use no generic magic items but a few powerful ones with edges&flaws.

Variant classes are strongly advisable since spellcasters grow too strong otherwise without magical countermeasures by the enemies.

 

[kengar]

Has anyone out there designed an alternate magic system that they found worked well for their campaign? I don't want to totally unbalance the spellcasters, I just want to de-emphasize magic in the world a bit. I would like spells and magic items to be remarkable, not everyday. I want powerful spellcasters to be impressive and respected, but I don't want a PC wizard to be so powerful as to unbalance the game world.

 

[MerakSpielman]

The lore to create items has been lost. If a character takes a creation feat, he can create:

Potions, Wands and Scrolls of spells he knows (as usual)

other items: He has never seen such an item before. He needs to study an existing one before he can duplicate it.

But creation will be very expensive. Magical ingredients and reagents are rare at best. Double or triple the cost to craft, and/or make the characters have to find rare ingredients themselves. ("Well, for a Ring of Spell Absorption, first you need the gel from the central eye of a beholder, then...")

Due to bad DMing my current low-magic campaign turned into a monty-haul campaign. Blame me.