How to run a big scene without bogging down?

[Abstraction]

The players in my game are coming to a major story point. They just finished slaying the undead dragon rat god beneath the temple, but managed to arouse several different factions to action. So after the last session, the group is about to enter the main worship area of the temple. There will be an already ongoing battle between the forces of the wererat cult of the dragon, the Empire and the Blue Cloaks. Each of these forces is bitterly opposed to the other two. Add to that the fact that the PCs have managed to make enemies of all of them! Although the PCs could just slip away, they are known to be carrying a powerful artifact that every other faction of course wants.

So, that's the story. Now for the mechanics. Each faction should have a good number of combatants, number unsure. The description when the PCs enter will include quite a fair number of bodies, so the low-level mooks are already dead but the guys still up will be almost completely fresh. Each faction will also have brought their big heavy monster. The cult is unleashing the half-dragon owlbear they stole from the Blue Cloaks that was originally for an ambush against the PCs. The Blue Cloaks are bringing a friendly Dragonne (as they have draconic ties). The Empire is bringing an enslaved Gauth.

I want this to be cool and epic with the PCs able to take a major hand and perhaps defeat all the others. How do I run so much without detracting from the PCs actions?

 

[Scurvy_Platypus]

Me?

I'd have the players run the faction combat, as well as their own characters. Just lay out who the factions are (A hates B, but is willing to work with C if it means D will get taken down too) and let folks take a faction each. Maybe let a player take on controlling some special critter if there's not enough factions to go around.

Or if there's plenty of special critter to go around, you run the factions, and let the players run the critters. Maybe the critters will be well behaved not not snack on their owners, maybe they go wild and start lashing out at whatever is the nearest target.

Just let the players cut loose and join in on the mayhem in some fashion like that, where they don't have to worry about their character getting snarfed in the middle of everything.

The can beat the snot out of each other, and if/when their interest wanes, if there's any of their faction left over, you can "take control" of whatever is left, and decide what the survivors would do.

As things go along, make sure to _explicitly_ ask what the characters are doing while all of this goes on. Who cares if the player(s) metagame a bit between the faction they're running and their character. The player will still likely feel invested, because they're actually getting to do something.

Maybe break things up along the lines of a "double initiative" depending on how complex things are. First the PCs do their thing, and then the factions do their thing.

I'd also personally abstract out the faction combat. While the factions fight amongst themselves, leave them as mostly mooks fighting each other. When it comes to PC vs Faction, then you can "zoom in" and go for the more detailed combat. That way things move along nice and quick, but when the PCs deal with individual members, they can see that the factions aren't push-overs. In other words, you're playing with the scale of things.

Faction vs Faction, the people are relatively similar and you don't really need to worry about it. Faction vs PC, the Faction people aren't simply mooks, and therefore get the "zoomed in" longer combat.

But I kinda like simple approaches to things, along with Players getting to do cool stuff in the game. So that advice might not be worth much to you.

 

[Piratecat]

Don't roll attacks for the factions. Instead, decide what will happen if the PCs DON'T get involved -- and that'll let you see how they swing the combat to one side or another.

 

[el-remmen]

Don't roll attacks for the factions. Instead, decide what will happen if the PCs DON'T get involved -- and that'll let you see how they swing the combat to one side or another.

That is also my advice. In my "Out of the Frying Pan" campaign I ran several comabt with three or more "sides" - and one of th ways I handled it was by having one of more factions looking to do something other than fight. . . For example, while the fighting is going along, perhaps one of the factions is trying to open some locked portal, or find the doo-dad of whiz-bang, or whatever - allowing the PCs the choice to try to avoid the chaotic melee and concentrate on one faction - then you can pick and choose round by round who from the main fight gets involved in the "goal-oriented" fight.

 

[howandwhy99]

Don't roll attacks for the factions. Instead, decide what will happen if the PCs DON'T get involved -- and that'll let you see how they swing the combat to one side or another.

Ditto. It's so much easier when you know what's up before the PCs get involved.

If you like randomness, one option is to pre-roll. This can work well sometimes for Random Encounters too.

 

[barsoomcore]

The cult is unleashing the half-dragon owlbear they stole.

That must have been one desperate dragon. I'm just saying.

Anyway, agree with PKitty, blah blah blah.

I would just suggest you have one crazy unforeseen attack from each faction -- the Blue Cloaks have been preparing a ritual that will enable them to throw down a Mordenkainen's Disjunction, or the Empire brought a scroll with Chain Lightning on it, or something. The idea being that if one group or another ends up with an early lead, and looks to be overwhelming things before Maximum Fun has been reached, you can just have one of the more beleaguered groups yank out their Saturday Night Special and ka-BOOM! You've got a whole new ball game.

Plus, it's fun for players to imagine their characters ducking through a wild combat that's REALLY going over the top.

That's what's worked for me, anyway. The conclusion of Barsoom Tales II is going to be a combat that took three sessions to play out, with numerous factions doing their level best to keep each other from (as they saw it) destroying the world. The PCs were WAY outmatched, and just tried to keep their heads down while accomplishing THEIR goal.

 

[blargney the second]

Don't roll attacks for the factions. Instead, decide what will happen if the PCs DON'T get involved -- and that'll let you see how they swing the combat to one side or another.

Damn, I wish I'd read that advice before last game. I was running the first big combat in Voyage of the Golden Dragon, and muffed the hordes of NPCs pretty badly. Oh well, live and learn.
-blarg

 

[Twinswords]

Pkitty is right. But also try to have different factions have different combat tactics. For example a wizard cabal will use minions or summons as fodder and will blast away from that defense perimeter. A lawful army will do formations like shieldwall with reach weapons behind it. Chaotic factions will have beserkers charging in. A rogue guild will have loose teams try to gang up on people. etc.etc. It makes for a much intertesting visual picture.

 

[Abstraction]

That must have been one desperate dragon. I'm just saying.

My game is very PG-13. I don't even acknowledge the existence of sex. A dragon died under the city 200 years ago and its essence has leaked out into a variety of things. In my homebrew, I use the term dragontouched or feytouched instead of half-x. And no, I don't mean touched like that.

 

[kensanata]

I always tell me players that D&D features both abstract combat as well as abstract procreation. Works for us. If they start to argue I tell them that basically D&D exists in a multiverse where Lamarkism works and Darwinism does not.