D&D 5E I might have bitten off more than I can chew

ArchfiendBobbie

First Post
My group and I got together and worked on creating a rather unique DnD setting. One that could be adapted easily from setting to setting. And we might have gotten too ambitious.

The key item that we're working on are the magic-powered mechs. As in, Battletech mechs. Only, armed with magical weaponry and powered by elemental forces instead of technology.

One of the first things we settled on is that the mechs would require two pilots: One to keep the vehicle moving, turn it, stop it, turn, and such through a complex system of levers. And one to control the weapons and defenses.

At some point, we got so busy on designing the controls that we forgot the important aspect: Stating the thing up for DnD and determining how the weapons work.

So, any advice on how to stat this up in 5E? This goes well beyond anything I've ever homebrewed before.
 

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the_cowley

Explorer
There are lots of systems that have this. Also, how powerful and prevalent are these mechs? that will determine their damage. look at scale damages for spells and traps
 

ArchfiendBobbie

First Post
The mechs themselves are rare. They're remnants of a former civilization. Their purpose is completely unknown.

And when found, every single one starts in a state of serious disrepair. They've not been used or maintained in centuries, and they show it.

Edit: To help a bit... Most people don't know these things exist, and all stories of them are thought to be myths or misunderstanding of existing war machines and constructs of the period. Even most extremely-determined adventurers have only come away with the idea they once existed, but are likely completely lost.

But at the same time, they are just constructs. Very large constructs. They could be built today, if anyone were willing to invest the vast amount of resources.
 
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Caliburn101

Explorer
Use the basic construct as baselines (don't use golems with their magic resistance unless that's a important thing) and scale them up using the DMG rules on monster modification.

Then come up with rules for the pilot and gunner being hit. Let's say a critical does half damage to the mech and half to one of the people inside, and any 'death from massive damage result' impacts the elemental 'core' requiring a save from the pilot or gunner to keep critical systems online (maybe make a table for random roles for the systems involved).

Hope this gives you some ideas. :)
 

the_cowley

Explorer
Also, if they are so rare, look at DMG legendary magic items. Also, the animate armor spell might help a bit for damage and hp relevant to size
 

ArchfiendBobbie

First Post
I'm definitely considering the suggestions so far.

One aspect that will be in place, looking at them: Maintenance. If you're going to own a giant pilotable golem, you're going to pay money to keep the thing functioning. It'll make them a nice gold sink for higher-level players, and will make players question if they really want to find another one of these with how much they spend on just one.

Once I have a basic version designed, I'll work out upgrade possibilities. Of course, those also tend to increase the maintenance cost.
 

Also, if they are so rare, look at DMG legendary magic items. Also, the animate armor spell might help a bit for damage and hp relevant to size
The Apparatus of Kwalish comes to mind.

When I ran my game, I just used stats for an Empyrian. It's big, it hits hard, and it shoots lasers. It's essentially a warmech, but without the nuclear option.
 

pemerton

Legend
I'd start with the Mighty Servant of Leuk-O. From the AD&D DMG p 169:

The Mighty Servant of the famous General Leuk-O is a towering automaton of crystal, unknown metals, and strange fibrous material. It is over 9' tall, 6' deep, and some 4½' wide, Inside is a compartment suitable for holding 2 man-sized creatures, and there is space for 4-5 others to sit outside. If the possessor knows the proper command phrases, he or she can use the Mighty Servant as a transportation mode, magical attack device, or fighting machine. It is armor class -1 and can withstand 60 hit points of damage. Note all weapons do only 50% of normal damage (round down). The Mighty Servant regenerates (self-repairs) 2 points of damage per round, Its magic resistance is 100%. Acid, cold, fire, heat, vacuum, and/or water have no effect on the device. Electrical/lightning attacks cause only 20% normal damage (round down), even if the Servant fails the magic resistance check.

The Mighty Servant moves at a maximum speed of 3". After each 12 hours of operation it must rest (recharge) itself for 1 hour. Any intelligent viewer within 12" must save versus magic (+2 on the die roll) or flee in panic. It can attack but 1 time per round, and it has a base 15% chance to hit an opponent regardless of its armor class. Opponents with intelligence and a dexterity of 15 or better reduce the base chance to hit by 2½% per 1 point of dexterity above 14. A hit from the Mighty Servant causes 10-100 hit points of damage.​

Converting that to 5e:

AC 21 (ascending rather than descending)
hp 200 (this is the same as a cloud giant - in AD&D cloud giants average 58.5 hp, which is pretty close to 60)
Speed 10' (3" is one-quarter base human speed; this is a rough approximation to that)
Resistance to non-magic bludgeoning, piercing or slashing; lightning (corresponds roughly to the AD&D stats)
Immune to acid, cold, fire damage (same as AD&D)
Magic Resistance advantage on saving throws against spells and other magical effects (like an archmage; reflects AD&D MR)
Regeneration 5 hp per round (similar ratio of regen to total hp as the AD&D version)​

I would drop the "cause fear" effect, which I think is meant to simulate the effect a mech will have on morale.

The immunity to water and vacuum I would fold into the description rather than the basic stats: ie the compartment is water proof, and those within it have an air supply even if there is no air outside.

That leaves the attack and damage component. The Might Servant hits on 18+ regardless of AC; but DEX provides half the normal bonus (+2½% per point above 14, rather than +5% as normal). This is not appropriate for 5e. Let's say that, against a well-armoured fighter the Might Servant hits on 18+; and against a leather-armoured and dextrous thief the Might Servant hits on 20 only. In 5e terms, that's an 18 to hit an AC 22 fighter (allowing for some magic), or +4 to hit; and 20 to hit an AC 18 thief (again, allowing for some magic), or a -2 to hit. Splitting the difference is +1 to hit.

That might seem fairly low - but it is pretty low in AD&D also. If you're going to keep the attack bonus low, I'd keep the damage high: 55 hp damage (or 10d10) has a certain oomph to it!

Anyway, with those stats the Mighty Servant is clearly far more robust than a cloud giant (more hp given its regen, much better AC, and resistances/immunities). Assuming attack bonuses of +10, it will be hit only on 11+ rather than 4+, which nearly doubles its staying power before factoring in immunities and regen.

But it's much less dangerous as an attacker: assuming AC 19 as a norm, the giant hits 7 in 10 twice for 21 damage each time, or DPR of around 30 per round; the Might Servant with +1 to hit will hit 3 in 20 for 55, or DPR of around 8. Maybe you'd want to give it two attacks per round, or boost its attack bonus (+4 will double its DPR vs AC 19, putting back on some sort of par with the cloud giant - halved DPR, but about twice as durable).
 

Mercule

Adventurer
Don't sweat the small stuff and steal liberally. @permerton has some good suggestions, above.

I'll add that my first thought was to just go with stats for an iron golem and not sweat the details on how it moved, other than "the pilot must spend their action controlling the mech". That would be for a fully repaired mech. You could use stats for lower classes of golems for somewhat worse off mechs, even if they're cosmetically the same. Even though there are some differences in resistances and abilities between the different golems, I'm sure a few minutes would show you patterns you wanted to keep and you'd shortly have some standard stats for mechs of various types.

As far as the gunner goes, I'd just grab the Gunsmith Artificer from last week's UA. I would never allow the kit in a standard game, as is, but the mechanics are a pretty good launching point for a big gun. Instead of having it tied to the class, tie it to the mech and have all the various level-based abilities be cannon refits that your PCs can find/make and that require a short rest to swap out. Maybe another special item exists that allows a back-up weapon, but it takes an action (or bonus action) to swap out.

For a real twist, just allow the Gunsmith, but reflavor it to work like a Battletech Clan Elemental (kinda). The clockwork servant is actually the suit (see this weeks UA Fighter for ideas on being size large). The character is actually wearing/riding the suit, so they occupy the same space and count as a single large creature for most purposes. The suit uses the action economy of the clockwork servant and people can target either the suit or the character with their attacks (it might be best to say the suit auto-repairs 1d8 damage every round, so long as you aren't directing it to do anything else; this healing increases by 1d8 each time the character gains a spell level). All class abilities are assumed to be part of the suit, and the character loses them if the suit is rendered inoperable (0 hp). Unless utterly destroyed, an inoperable suit is fully repaired after a long rest and any normal damage is repaired after a short rest.

You could also probably do something to rework the Artificer class to be a Mech-Warrior class, reskinning the Gunsmith to be a Gunner and adding a new Pilot specialty. Replace some of the existing class abilities with ways of repairing a mech on the fly and getting them to do interesting things. The Gunner would, of course, apply their abilities to the mech's guns. Any character can run a mech, but the Mech-Warrior does it best.

That's all pretty train of thought, but it's probably a reasonable starting point to tweak for balance.
 

Mallus

Legend
Two things immediately come to mind:

One, watch The Vision of Escaflowne if you haven't already.

Two, the old-school way to do this would be to just use Battletech or some other mech wargame to handle the mecha stuf. Lightly re-skinning on the fly, as needed, i.e. don't even bother trying to find mecha mechanics in the D&D idiom.
 

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