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<blockquote data-quote="Ltheb Silverfrond" data-source="post: 4411011" data-attributes="member: 39867"><p>Upper_Krust!</p><p></p><p>Yesterday, after finishing up some final work on my current game, I spent some thought on 4E Immortal's Math. Plugging the DMG guidelines, and the numbers from your sites' table, I noticed a slight math 'hiccup'. Monster Defenses scales ~ faster then projected PC bonuses to hit. It was a small error, but it means at the upper tiers of play that players are going to need a few more 'pluses' to hit. (On the order of about +1/5-10 levels)</p><p></p><p>My train of though started, absurdly (as usual) at level 100. A level 100 solo, by DMG guidelines, is really easy to work out, but his Defenses (AC 119; Fortitude 112, Reflex 115, Will 117) are about ~25 points higher then average PC projected to-hit modifiers.</p><p>Projected PC Hit mods:</p><p>Stat: Say base 16, +2 from race. (18 total)</p><p> - +2 per 10 levels (+20; 38 total)</p><p> - +1 to all attributes at each tier (assuming each tier is every 10 levels) (+10, 48 total)</p><p>So a maximum attribute, barring class mods (few of these I assume), is 48 - 50. Modifier +19-20.</p><p>Magic weapon is +1/5 levels, or +20 at 100th.</p><p>+39-40</p><p>+1/2 Level</p><p>+89-90</p><p>Proficiency is another +2-3 usually, plus the odd feat or two, you still end up being over 21 points (30 worst case, 27 points best case) short.</p><p></p><p>Even if you plan to end immortal's at 75th level, the problem will crop up there too. (22-20 points likely missing at 75th)</p><p></p><p>Simple solution is to work in some +'s.</p><p></p><p>As a Side note, Designing a Timelord is easy and fun in 4E, even without having to make up any new rules or conditions.</p><p>[sblock]</p><p>Anti-Spiral Collective</p><p>Level 100 Solo Timelord </p><p>Zetta-Large Immortal humanoid</p><p>XP: All of it</p><p>Initiative +79</p><p>Senses Perception +75; darkvision, Truesight ∞, Timesight ∞</p><p>HP 4355; Bloodied 2177; see also Indignation power.</p><p>Regeneration 50</p><p>AC 119; Fortitude 112, Reflex 115, Will 117</p><p>Immune: Poison, Disease, Stunning</p><p>Resist: Psychic 55</p><p>Saving Throws +5</p><p>Speed ∞; see also Random Schroedinger Warp power</p><p>Action Points 2</p><p>M Unarmed Strike (standard; at-will)</p><p>Reach ∞; +109 vs. AC; 10d10+50 damage.</p><p>m Time Dilation (standard; at-will) * Time, Cosmic</p><p>The Anti-Spiral Collective makes two Unarmed Strike attacks.</p><p>m Galaxy Suplex (standard; at-will) </p><p>+109 vs AC; 16d10+50 damage and the target slides into a square adjacent to the Anti-Spiral Collective and is grabbed (until escape). While grabbed, the target loses any resistances it has. </p><p>r Galaxy Shuriken (standard; at-will)</p><p>Range ∞; +106 vs. Reflex; 14d10 + 50 damage and the target is knocked prone.</p><p>r Space-time Manipulation (Minor; at-will) * Time, Space, Cosmic</p><p>Range ∞; +106 vs. Will; 7d10 + 50 damage and the target is marked.</p><p>c Beamspam (standard; recharge 456) * Force</p><p>Close burst ∞; +107 vs. Will; 20d10 + 50 Force damage and the target is dazed (save ends).</p><p>a Anti-Matter Blast (Standard; Recharge 6) * Anti-Matter, Transcendent</p><p>Close Blast ∞; +107 vs. Fortitude; 37d10 + 50 damage plus an ongoing 50 damage and the target is weakened (save ends both).</p><p>r Infinity Big Bang Storm (Standard; encounter) * Omnific</p><p>Ranged ∞; +107 vs. Fortitude; The target loses all it's hit points. Further, it takes ongoing damage equal to it's healing surge value (save ends).</p><p>Indignation (immediate reaction, when first bloodied; encounter)</p><p>The Anti-Spiral Collective immediately recharges it's Infinity Big Bang Storm Power and uses it as part of this action.</p><p>Random Schroedinger Warp (Move; Recharge 5 6) * Teleportation, Transcendent</p><p>The Anti-Spiral Collective Teleports ∞ Squares and gains combat advantage against any opponents it ends it's move adjacent to.</p><p>Abrogate (Immediate Interrupt; when a foe uses a power; recharge 5 6) * Cosmic</p><p>The foe's power operates without any effect. The power's user loses the action spent on the power and expends use of the power without benefit. If the Anti-Spiral Collective has combat advantage against the power's user, that power cannot be used for the rest of the encounter.</p><p>Combat Advantage</p><p>The Anti-Spiral Collective deals an additional 150 damage to foes it has combat advantage against.</p><p>Alignment Unaligned</p><p>Languages Polyglot</p><p>Skills All (Ability Modifier +5)</p><p>Str 70 (+80)</p><p>Dex 65 (+77)</p><p>Wis 60 (+70)</p><p>Con 63 (+76)</p><p>Int 60 (+70)</p><p>Cha 67 (+78)</p><p>[/sblock]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ltheb Silverfrond, post: 4411011, member: 39867"] Upper_Krust! Yesterday, after finishing up some final work on my current game, I spent some thought on 4E Immortal's Math. Plugging the DMG guidelines, and the numbers from your sites' table, I noticed a slight math 'hiccup'. Monster Defenses scales ~ faster then projected PC bonuses to hit. It was a small error, but it means at the upper tiers of play that players are going to need a few more 'pluses' to hit. (On the order of about +1/5-10 levels) My train of though started, absurdly (as usual) at level 100. A level 100 solo, by DMG guidelines, is really easy to work out, but his Defenses (AC 119; Fortitude 112, Reflex 115, Will 117) are about ~25 points higher then average PC projected to-hit modifiers. Projected PC Hit mods: Stat: Say base 16, +2 from race. (18 total) - +2 per 10 levels (+20; 38 total) - +1 to all attributes at each tier (assuming each tier is every 10 levels) (+10, 48 total) So a maximum attribute, barring class mods (few of these I assume), is 48 - 50. Modifier +19-20. Magic weapon is +1/5 levels, or +20 at 100th. +39-40 +1/2 Level +89-90 Proficiency is another +2-3 usually, plus the odd feat or two, you still end up being over 21 points (30 worst case, 27 points best case) short. Even if you plan to end immortal's at 75th level, the problem will crop up there too. (22-20 points likely missing at 75th) Simple solution is to work in some +'s. As a Side note, Designing a Timelord is easy and fun in 4E, even without having to make up any new rules or conditions. [sblock] Anti-Spiral Collective Level 100 Solo Timelord Zetta-Large Immortal humanoid XP: All of it Initiative +79 Senses Perception +75; darkvision, Truesight ∞, Timesight ∞ HP 4355; Bloodied 2177; see also Indignation power. Regeneration 50 AC 119; Fortitude 112, Reflex 115, Will 117 Immune: Poison, Disease, Stunning Resist: Psychic 55 Saving Throws +5 Speed ∞; see also Random Schroedinger Warp power Action Points 2 M Unarmed Strike (standard; at-will) Reach ∞; +109 vs. AC; 10d10+50 damage. m Time Dilation (standard; at-will) * Time, Cosmic The Anti-Spiral Collective makes two Unarmed Strike attacks. m Galaxy Suplex (standard; at-will) +109 vs AC; 16d10+50 damage and the target slides into a square adjacent to the Anti-Spiral Collective and is grabbed (until escape). While grabbed, the target loses any resistances it has. r Galaxy Shuriken (standard; at-will) Range ∞; +106 vs. Reflex; 14d10 + 50 damage and the target is knocked prone. r Space-time Manipulation (Minor; at-will) * Time, Space, Cosmic Range ∞; +106 vs. Will; 7d10 + 50 damage and the target is marked. c Beamspam (standard; recharge 456) * Force Close burst ∞; +107 vs. Will; 20d10 + 50 Force damage and the target is dazed (save ends). a Anti-Matter Blast (Standard; Recharge 6) * Anti-Matter, Transcendent Close Blast ∞; +107 vs. Fortitude; 37d10 + 50 damage plus an ongoing 50 damage and the target is weakened (save ends both). r Infinity Big Bang Storm (Standard; encounter) * Omnific Ranged ∞; +107 vs. Fortitude; The target loses all it's hit points. Further, it takes ongoing damage equal to it's healing surge value (save ends). Indignation (immediate reaction, when first bloodied; encounter) The Anti-Spiral Collective immediately recharges it's Infinity Big Bang Storm Power and uses it as part of this action. Random Schroedinger Warp (Move; Recharge 5 6) * Teleportation, Transcendent The Anti-Spiral Collective Teleports ∞ Squares and gains combat advantage against any opponents it ends it's move adjacent to. Abrogate (Immediate Interrupt; when a foe uses a power; recharge 5 6) * Cosmic The foe's power operates without any effect. The power's user loses the action spent on the power and expends use of the power without benefit. If the Anti-Spiral Collective has combat advantage against the power's user, that power cannot be used for the rest of the encounter. Combat Advantage The Anti-Spiral Collective deals an additional 150 damage to foes it has combat advantage against. Alignment Unaligned Languages Polyglot Skills All (Ability Modifier +5) Str 70 (+80) Dex 65 (+77) Wis 60 (+70) Con 63 (+76) Int 60 (+70) Cha 67 (+78) [/sblock] [/QUOTE]
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