D&D 5E Interrupting a Long Rest

[iserith]

That's cool but it certainly doesn't apply to me as a newbie my interpretation of the long rest RAW interruption was the same as Yunru's et al. An hour of walking, or any combat, etc. Of course I'm using my alternate travel rules so the players have an adventuring day or two on a long journey instead of dribs and drabs. But this approach seems very good for resting in a dungeon.

Oh yes, I'm sure there are plenty of people who interpret it that way based on text alone. But I sure do catch a whiff of old school players like me in here for many of us traditions die hard deaths.

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

'Resting', in both natural language AND 5E RAW, is 'avoiding strenuous activity'.

If we assume that the definition for "rest" used by the game is the natural language definition, that raises a question; What is the purpose behind the author saying the following?:

"They need rest - time to sleep and eat, tend their wounds, refresh their minds and spirits for spellcasting, and brace themselves for further adventure." instead of "They need rest."

"A short rest is a period of downtime, at least 1 hour long, during which a character does nothing more strenuous than eating, drinking, reading, and tending wounds." instead of "A short rest is a period of downtime, at least 1 hour long."

"A long rest is a period of extended downtime, at least 8 hours long, during which a character sleeps or performs light activity: reading, talking, eating, or standing watch for no more than 2 hours." instead of "A long rest is a period of extended downtime, at least 8 hours long, during which a character can sleep. A character can also stand watch for up to 2 hours during a long rest."

So, RAW, there are not two different types of inactivity!

You are missing the forest for the trees - I am not talking about how many types of inactivity there are (which, by the way, it's strange to call what the book calls "light activity" "inactivity" because those words are not synonymous). I am talking about how many game terms or elements the rules present relating to rest, and that number is 2 - Short Rest, and Long Rest - which is clear because each gets it's own paragraph heading in large, underlined text.

 

[Arial Black]

You are missing the forest for the trees - I am not talking about how many types of inactivity there are (which, by the way, it's strange to call what the book calls "light activity" "inactivity" because those words are not synonymous). I am talking about how many game terms or elements the rules present relating to rest, and that number is 2 - Short Rest, and Long Rest - which is clear because each gets it's own paragraph heading in large, underlined text.

And my point is that the two types of rest are not two different types of activity (or even 'inactivity'); they are two different benefits for different amounts of the same type of activity/inactivity.

Further, the two different benefits are related; the long rest just gives you what the short rest gives you, but maybe more of/better benefits.

Both allow you to heal, but short rest lets you use hit dice to heal while long rest gives you all your hit points back and lets you regain half your hit dice. The same thing conceptually, but just more of it.

Abilities which recharge on a short rest also recharge on a long rest. Some abilities don't recharge on a short rest. So the short rest recharges a subset of the abilities that a long rest recharges.

Again, they are not two unrelated benefits but one is 'the same but more' of the other, just like one is 'the same but more' of rest.

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

Abilities which recharge on a short rest also recharge on a long rest.

Look at all of those abilities.

What reason, other than that they are two distinct game elements and not the natural language usage of the words included, is there for those abilities to say "...finish a short rest or a long rest..." instead of "...finish a rest..."?

 

[Lanefan]

Look at all of those abilities.

What reason, other than that they are two distinct game elements and not the natural language usage of the words included, is there for those abilities to say "...finish a short rest or a long rest..." instead of "...finish a rest..."?

Because you just know that the first question from everyone would be "Do they mean a short rest, a long rest, or either type?".

That said, "...finish any rest..." covers it.

Lanefan

 

[Arial Black]

Look at all of those abilities.

What reason, other than that they are two distinct game elements and not the natural language usage of the words included, is there for those abilities to say "...finish a short rest or a long rest..." instead of "...finish a rest..."?

They could indeed just say 'finish a rest', if 'rest' were the name of a game mechanic.

The game could easily have made 'rest' a game mechanic and 'short rest' and 'long rest' as subsets of 'rest'. They didn't write in 'rest' as a game mechanic, and since game mechanics must refer to game mechanics then those abilities must refer to game mechanics. 'Finish a short or long rest' is needed because these are game mechanics, while 'rest' isn't.

That being said, the way to get the game mechanical benefits of either type of rest is to indulge in the same types of activity/non-activity, but for differing lengths of time. The activities/non-activities themselves are not game mechanics; the DM simply determines whether or not what you are doing counts as the game mechanic: 'strenuous activity'.

 

[The-Magic-Sword]

(I should note that my long rests are 24 hours and my short rests are 8 hours, this is only to expand the 6-8 encounter adventuring day over a few days, because I find it hard to get to the late-in-the-day encounters with diminished resources otherwise, it doesn't really matter much)



Short rests are to me what long rests are to you, same sleep requirement and such. The 24 hour long rest is a little more lenient- the point of a long rest is the full-recharge after all, so it generally happens when i want it to happen (between adventures) anyway- so i'm not too particular. I mostly ask "what do you do on your day off?" and so long as the answer isn't "adventuring" it's generally fine. In that sense, my rests are very gamey- the long rests aren't so much options as something that happens in the narrative as part of encounter progression, because a day off is aklso a break in the narrative tension, this allows me to design things so that the end of the mechanical tension (full recharge) is also the end of the narrative tension (things are such that we can take a day off.)

I feel not enough DMs think of it this way, the role resting plays on pacing, while the players CAN choose to break to rest, avoiding a 5 minute work day requires you to basically force them not to narratively- so you should think of the adventuring "day" as a narrative unit, a 6-8 encounter build up followed by a discharge of tension, short rests are more minor discharges of tension, like checkpoints. In this context worrying about what a rest is becomes trivial, because resting doesn't happen unless tension is breaking down anyway.

Then it becomes a question of resource management between rests, and you can view any "cheesing" in that light. I don't generally worry about something like mage armor, because i know it saves my players from keeping track of their AC without it, in addition to their AC with it, so i treat it almost as a ritual. Hex and hutner's mark still requires a valid (read: not bag of rats) target. Starting and ending rests at will is nonsensichal, because they just represent periods of non-activity, and the consequences for those based off the amount of time passed. It helps that rests are harder to cheese the longer they take.

 

[AaronOfBarbaria]

'Finish a short or long rest' is needed because these are game mechanics, while 'rest' isn't.

So there are in fact 2 game mechanics, yes?

If things were intended to work the way you insist that they do, with the time spent taking a long rest also counting as having taken a short rest and time spent taking a short rest counting toward time needed to take a long rest, it would be entirely redundant - and thus unnecessary - for abilities to say "...finish a short rest or long rest..." (special note: the phrasing of always putting the words 'short rest' and 'long rest' rather than the more natural 'short or long rest' that you've used here, is an important difference) because no one would finish a long rest without also finishing at least one short rest, so the abilities could just say "...finish a short rest."

And because I choose to believe that professional writers with professional editor don't deliberately and consistently waste words, that means there must be a reason why they've done exactly what they have done.

 

[Caliban]

Short Rest and Long Rest are metagame concepts - the characters are just "resting", but the players are usually trying for one or the other.

If you want to spend Hit Dice for healing and recharge Short rest abilities, you have to finish a Short rest.
If you want to regain half your total Hit Dice (and heal without spending hit dice), and recharge Long and Short rest abilities, you have to finish a Long Rest.

Adventure League makes a distinction between them - you can't turn a short rest into a long rest. You can take a short rest, spend hit dice to heal, and then immediately start a long rest if you wish, but it will be a total of at least 9 hours, not 8 hours. That's the ruling from the administration, I don't really have a strong opinion on the matter.

That being said, I using the same ruling in my home game. Merging a short test into a long rest just seems counter intuitive to me, in that you could rest an hour, regain some abilities and spend hit dice, and then rest 7 more hours and regain all the hit dice you spent and the rest of your abilities and count it all as the same long rest.

If I was going to argue the rules one way or the other, I'd say the important phrase is "at the end". If you end a short rest (i.e. spent hit dice to heal and recharged abilities), then you have voluntarily stopped resting, even if only for a few moments. You have to start resting again from scratch, so it would be another 8 hours if you also want a long rest.

But in the end, it's only the difference between taking an 8 hour break or a 9 hour break, so I'm not that worried about it.

 

[FrogReaver]

So there are in fact 2 game mechanics, yes?

If things were intended to work the way you insist that they do, with the time spent taking a long rest also counting as having taken a short rest and time spent taking a short rest counting toward time needed to take a long rest, it would be entirely redundant - and thus unnecessary - for abilities to say "...finish a short rest or long rest..." (special note: the phrasing of always putting the words 'short rest' and 'long rest' rather than the more natural 'short or long rest' that you've used here, is an important difference) because no one would finish a long rest without also finishing at least one short rest, so the abilities could just say "...finish a short rest."

And because I choose to believe that professional writers with professional editor don't deliberately and consistently waste words, that means there must be a reason why they've done exactly what they have done.

Yet, we all know professional writers and editors waste words and make mistakes and sometimes have no good reason for doing something a certain way other than they found it appealing in some way shape or form.

The book details both "heavy obscurement" and "cover". Yet both can happen at the same time. Two separate gaming elements doesn't mean the elements in question can never overlap in game.