Is gaming without map and minis really bad?

[tonym]

It is much easier for the DM to manipulate the PCs and railroad events if there are no minis for him to be accountable to.

Imagine a big battle in a large area...

PLAYER: Oh no! Dungeon Master, am I close enough to heal Tracy's dwarven Fighter before he goes unconscious?

What will the DM say?

It depends. If this was supposed to be a challenging battle and the PCs are having an easy time of it, the DM will likely say "No," simply to up the excitement-level.

On the other hand, if the PCs are being badly beaten and on the verge of a TPK, the DM will almost certainly say, "Yes, you are close enough."

Allowing the DM to make so many judgment calls makes the game more predictable, once a Player figures-out the pattern behind the DM's canned responses. A good DM will be harder to figure-out, but even they will become predictable eventually.

Minis on the table add to the excitement of D&D because they increase the risk of PC death; this is because the DM is accountable to the locations of the minis.

That is why I prefer minis.

IMO, players who prefer a mini-free game are players who want their DM to have the power to pull their PC's fat out of the fire during battles. And DMs who prefer a mini-free game are DMs who want more control over battles.

Tony M

 

[ShinHakkaider]

wow "Killer of Real Gaming Everywhere" tell that to someone who cant understand why thier fireball has to hit an ally when the target is being flanked by 2 said allies. I've played with people like that. It isn't that they lack imagination, or that they are stupid (well, not most of them) but that they have brains that are not wired the same as most others, they have to see some representation to be able to understand.

Exactly.

But as with most things it comes down to the group of people that you play with. You can have a group of "Role-Players" and still have them be BAD PLAYERS. Battlemat or no.

Battlemats and mini's dont automatically take away from role-playing, it boils down to the players and the tone the DM has set at the table.

So sick of the underlying ONE TRUE WAY mantra, I thought the idea was to have fun...

 

[Crothian]

It is much easier for the DM to manipulate the PCs and railroad events if there are no minis for him to be accountable to.

Instead he is held accountiable by the players and his own ability to describe and set the scene. Not using minis does not give the DM a lot more control over things.

 

[BryonD]

Instead he is held accountiable by the players and his own ability to describe and set the scene. Not using minis does not give the DM a lot more control over things.

IME a very small number of DMs live up to this accountability.

I'm still not saying you need minis for a good game. Just that you are trading one group of potential issues for another. Re-building the setting after the fact is a common issue that results in a form of added control. for good or bad....

 

[mr_outsidevoice]

Minis help with combat greatly, and they do not limit imagination.

 

[tonym]

IME a very small number of DMs live up to this accountability....

Right.

Like the time my PC and the other PCs staged an ambush. We figured we'd deliver several rounds of arrows before the enemy closed the distance.

Nope. The next round, toe-to-toe.

Or the time a PC died in combat. After the combat ended, it became clear there was a huge statue behind the PC that he could've used for cover, which meant he would've survived the battle.


Tony M

 

[Crothian]

Right.

I agree. Minis help bad DMs and can avoid confusion and miscommunication. I disagree that no minis makes the game more predictiable or that the game is less deadly.

 

[Emirikol]

I remember when 3.0 came out in 2000. There were still a few hold-out DM's who weren't using any kind of battlemat or mini's even though the 3.0 game now thrives on them. Most people walked away from those games.


jh

 

[GlassJaw]

Is gaming without minis bad? No.

Is it something I would want to do for an extended period of time? No.

 

[tonym]

Not using minis does not give the DM a lot more control over things.

My previous post has examples of more control by the DM. The first being the DM wanted our ambush to fail, and it did. If there were minis, the ambush would've been much more successful.

No minis = more DM control.

Tony M