Is Ptolus living up to the hype?

[Kristian Serrano]

I looked at the shelf next to it and Ebbrron or however its spelled, I cpounted 7 hardcovers.....and who knows how many more will come. $30 x 7 =$210...your getting towards double the cost....

Be aware that the extra hardcovers are purely optional. Those who ask for additional supplements and support want additional supplement and support. An argument against the cost of buying additional supplements is invalid when presented to individuals who desire more more material.

One could argue that Ptolus is intended to be a complete product with its voluminous collection of content, but that doesn't invalidate one's potential desire for newer material such as prestige classes, feats, magic items, spells, and additional flavoring for races and cultures.

Additionally, the scope of the Eberron Campaign Setting is international and transcontinental whereas Ptolus is focused on a single city, which is why Eberron has so many books.

If one were to acquire the Eberron books that might cover the same quantity of content that Ptolus covers, the cost might be similar, if not cheaper considering online retailers such as Amazon.com, which offers a price approximate to two-thirds the cover price.

For example, let's say one wanted enough information for the core setting, the primary city (i.e. - Sharn), and expanded information on races and religions. That would consist of four books (Eberron Campaign Setting at a cost of approximately $26 for the Eberron Campaign Setting and $18 for each of the supplements (Sharn: City of Towers, Races of Eberron, and Faiths of Eberron) from Amazon.com for a total approximate cost of $86. Not bad. That leaves enough room for a few more supplements and/or adventures to add to the collection. Let's not forget the free material Wizards of the Coast offers on the official Eberron web site, too.

In Ptolus' defense, having free PDFs of the Player's Guide to Ptolus is a very compelling aspect of the product. It was actually one of the primary reasons why I had considered it in the first place. I didn't think my players should have had to purchase a book for the campaign setting let alone try to absorb so much information. Ptolus assumes the rules contained within the D20 SRD leaving the players to only have to worry about the content in the Player's Guide. In all honesty, if I only had the D&D Core Rulebooks, I would have definitely chosen Ptolus. However, because of my existing investment and limited time, I thought it best to stick to what I know and what I had available.

I will also admit that the idea of a complete product such as Ptolus appeals to me. I was introduced to D&D as of the release of 3e, and I loved it when there were new supplements because I loved having options. As the years went by, I moved on to being a DM, and loved the options even more because they gave me more creative liberty. Although sometimes I wonder if running a game would be easier if I only had the D&D Core Rulebooks and Ptolus.

 

[carmachu]

Be aware that the extra hardcovers are purely optional. Those who ask for additional supplements and support want additional supplement and support. An argument against the cost of buying additional supplements is invalid when presented to individuals who desire more more material.

One could argue that Ptolus is intended to be a complete product with its voluminous collection of content, but that doesn't invalidate one's potential desire for newer material such as prestige classes, feats, magic items, spells, and additional flavoring for races and cultures.

Yes, actually, it does invalidate it. Thats the POINT of the product. Buying it "because its not supported" is a red herring: its not supported because it does need to be(but there is the Delvers Guild for "support", there just isnt going to be any more products, being a complete one).

Additionally, the scope of the Eberron Campaign Setting is international and transcontinental whereas Ptolus is focused on a single city, which is why Eberron has so many books.

If one were to acquire the Eberron books that might cover the same quantity of content that Ptolus covers, the cost might be similar, if not cheaper considering online retailers such as Amazon.com, which offers a price approximate to two-thirds the cover price.

No doubt. YOu could buy it from amazon, at 1/3 off(more like 20% after shipping) so it be roughly $140(2/3 off) to $168(20% off). I'm not counting used becuase its too variable, and thats assuming all 7 books are at $30.

And your point with inter/trans continal? There's a host of material in the spire......you seem to think of JUST the city, not the spire or anything else....

For example, let's say one wanted enough information for the core setting, the primary city (i.e. - Sharn), and expanded information on races and religions. That would consist of four books (Eberron Campaign Setting at a cost of approximately $26 for the Eberron Campaign Setting and $18 for each of the supplements (Sharn: City of Towers, Races of Eberron, and Faiths of Eberron) from Amazon.com for a total approximate cost of $86. Not bad. That leaves enough room for a few more supplements and/or adventures to add to the collection. Let's not forget the free material Wizards of the Coast offers on the official Eberron web site, too.

In Ptolus' defense, having free PDFs of the Player's Guide to Ptolus is a very compelling aspect of the product. It was actually one of the primary reasons why I had considered it in the first place. I didn't think my players should have had to purchase a book for the campaign setting let alone try to absorb so much information. Ptolus assumes the rules contained within the D20 SRD leaving the players to only have to worry about the content in the Player's Guide. In all honesty, if I only had the D&D Core Rulebooks, I would have definitely chosen Ptolus. However, because of my existing investment and limited time, I thought it best to stick to what I know and what I had available.

There's also the Delver's guild with a host of other free items, and of course, Monte cooks boards which has a DM board and players board.....

I will also admit that the idea of a complete product such as Ptolus appeals to me. I was introduced to D&D as of the release of 3e, and I loved it when there were new supplements because I loved having options. As the years went by, I moved on to being a DM, and loved the options even more because they gave me more creative liberty. Although sometimes I wonder if running a game would be easier if I only had the D&D Core Rulebooks and Ptolus.

While I like options, a complete book is a VERY nice thing, especially after 2nd edition,a nd the many many books in 3rd. Looking of FR or greyhawk or Ebbrron......I dont want to play keep up anymore. BTDT in 2nd.

I'm also concern on guality of the product. WIth Monte's stuff, for the most part, I know I'm going to get something good. With alot of the WotC books.....I'm really not sure their worth their cover price. WHich is why I pick them up through Amazon. I dont see them worth the $30 or so tag.

Ptolus? Worth the money, especially with the free goodies. Its easily the best product I've gotten in 3rd.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

Hey Colonel, your link is broken. I fixed it for ya.


Peace and smiles

j.

Good catch! Thanks much. I edited my original post.

 

[Kristian Serrano]

Yes, actually, it does invalidate it. Thats the POINT of the product. Buying it "because its not supported" is a red herring: its not supported because it does need to be(but there is the Delvers Guild for "support", there just isnt going to be any more products, being a complete one).

Isn't the Delver's Guild only available to those who pre-ordered?

No doubt. YOu could buy it from amazon, at 1/3 off(more like 20% after shipping) so it be roughly $140(2/3 off) to $168(20% off). I'm not counting used becuase its too variable, and thats assuming all 7 books are at $30.

For some reason, I don't see books such as Magic of Eberron, Secrets of Xen'Drik, Five Nations, and Explorer's Handbook as necessary at all for using the setting. I don't think it's fair to assume one would collect every book available. The point of the argument is that if someone wants an additional supplement that is released, they could buy it. Seriously, if Malhavoc or another publisher were to release additional Ptolus materials, GMs and players would most likely be inclined to purchase them.

And your point with inter/trans continal? There's a host of material in the spire......you seem to think of JUST the city, not the spire or anything else....

Obviously, I don't know Ptolus that well; I was just guessing/assuming.

There's also the Delver's guild with a host of other free items, and of course, Monte cooks boards which has a DM board and players board.....

Again, I was under the impression that the Delver's Guild is only available to those who pre-ordered.

I'm also concern on guality of the product. WIth Monte's stuff, for the most part, I know I'm going to get something good. With alot of the WotC books.....I'm really not sure their worth their cover price. WHich is why I pick them up through Amazon. I dont see them worth the $30 or so tag.

That's fair enough as I can't completely disagree.

 

[Jaws]

Again, I was under the impression that the Delver's Guild is only available to those who pre-ordered.

You can still "pre-order" and get Delver's Guild access.

http://www.frpgames.com/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=28329

Other places have this too but I'm not going to list them all.


Peace and smiles

j.

 

[Xyanthon]

I'm still waiting for my copy of Ptolus. I'm one of those that likes Monty's stuff but not a fanboy (I still just can't get into AU/AE even though I played in it for about a year). He's got some good ideas and some that I find I can't get into. With all that I've heard of Ptolus, I think it'll be something that I'll be able to get into.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Apologies for revisiting this thread, but wanting to use the CS account I paid for, I decided to go with Search over a new thread, and this existing thread pretty much asks the question I'm looking to have answered, which is "Is Ptolus living up to the hype?" It's been a couple months since the last post here, so more time has passed since the book's release. For you folks who have the book or have examined the book, do you recommend it? Would you plunk down the cash a second time, knowing what you know now?

I'm considering purchasing Ptolus because I love the idea of a city that fully accomodates the RAW, but I'm also definitely hoping to benefit from everyone's hindsight. I could just nick Monte's fantastic idea and make my own city based on his theory, so I guess what I'm wanting to know is whether the book is worth its cost.

 

[darkbard]

Honestly, I feel it's the best money I've ever spent on gaming products--with the exception of the core books. (And in terms of pure reading goodness, it exceeds even those.)

I couldn't recommend it more highly. The only problem is that once you see how cool Ptolus is, you will be likely (as I did) to abandon your other campaign books immediately.

 

[ChefOrc]

I bought Ptolus as it came out, because I was such a fan of Monte's Ptolus campaign journals and overall work.

I think this book is the most impressive RPG product I have ever seen. Yes, it definitely lives up to the hype, both in quality and quantity of material. The art is really nice, the factions and their interactions are very inspiring (and to me, the best part of the book), the main adventure line is really fun for players and DMs, the organization of the book is lightyears ahead of any other product out there, and the preview material available to the players (Ptolus Player's Guide) makes it so easy for players to get excited about the setting,

Do I think it is perfect? No. I personnaly feel that there is way too much emphasis on mundane events, descriptions and adventure hooks ("thief stealing bread in a bakery" type of thing), and painfully not enough on the more fantastic aspects (the vast dungeon below the city really does not get much description). I am not happy with the no-support policy (although I completely respect Monte's desire to pursue another type of work, and I know that the Delver's Square fan site provides some support, but still, this aspect is a minus for the product), I think the main adventure plotline lacks originality, not is the details (actually, this is one of the greatest strengths of this product), but on the overall theme (mad cultists want to destroy the world by bringing back dark gods) which has been done to death.

Overall, let's just say I wrote the "pros" paragraph in a second, with lots of enthusiams, and it took me long minutes of head scratching to write the "cons" paragraph. I love this product.

 

[The Lost Muse]

It's a very useful book, and I am shortly going to begin running a campaign in the city.

Tim