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Is the grandson of a Baron a noble?
- Thread starter Ariddrake
- Start date
Celebrim
Legend
Generally speaking, only if the grandson is the son of the Baron's heir.
The Baron's children are Lords and Ladies, but unless they have a title to inherit their children don't inherit a title.
The Baron's heir inherits his title and usually has some sort of demi-title in his own right, so his children are also Lords and Ladies.
UPDATE: Hmm... you seemed to edit the post faster than I could respond. In general, no, merely being the cousin of a noble doesn't make you noble, but since noble families tend to marry into each other its a good bet that a given noble's cousins are also nobles of some rank.
The Baron's children are Lords and Ladies, but unless they have a title to inherit their children don't inherit a title.
The Baron's heir inherits his title and usually has some sort of demi-title in his own right, so his children are also Lords and Ladies.
UPDATE: Hmm... you seemed to edit the post faster than I could respond. In general, no, merely being the cousin of a noble doesn't make you noble, but since noble families tend to marry into each other its a good bet that a given noble's cousins are also nobles of some rank.
Storm Raven
First Post
Ariddrake said:I was looking around on the web trying to find out what qualifies a person a noble besides the obvious (Count chocula, King Vitamin)? Are there cousins considered nobility? Thanks.
The answer, in the real world, would depend on what country you are talking about, and what era.
BiggusGeekus
That's Latin for "cool"
My understanding.....
Let's say a Baron has two sons. Son A is going to be the baron. Son B is simply "well off". He's probably going to be knighted, unless he really, really messes up.
The Son of Son B, let's call him Grandson B, is also in line for a knighthood. However, being a knight is NOT herditary. There's more opportunity for him to screw up. His best bet is to swear fealty to someone, probably Grandson A, and basically hope for the best.
Now, there's another level called "Baronets" that I have a weaker understanding of. To wit: Son A gets the barony and Son B gets some farmland with what ammounts to be a glorified farmhouse. That is herditary, but Grandson B in this case would be strongly discouraged from having more than one son.
But I admit there are many gaps in my knowledge. I welcome correction.
Let's say a Baron has two sons. Son A is going to be the baron. Son B is simply "well off". He's probably going to be knighted, unless he really, really messes up.
The Son of Son B, let's call him Grandson B, is also in line for a knighthood. However, being a knight is NOT herditary. There's more opportunity for him to screw up. His best bet is to swear fealty to someone, probably Grandson A, and basically hope for the best.
Now, there's another level called "Baronets" that I have a weaker understanding of. To wit: Son A gets the barony and Son B gets some farmland with what ammounts to be a glorified farmhouse. That is herditary, but Grandson B in this case would be strongly discouraged from having more than one son.
But I admit there are many gaps in my knowledge. I welcome correction.
Mark
CreativeMountainGames.com
rogueattorney
Adventurer
Generally speaking, unless the relative gets his own land somehow, he wouldn't be considered a noble. He'd still be considered 'high born', and would have the chance to become a knight. A very powerful or wealthy family may have more than one estate to pass from relative to relative. Of course this all depends on your campaign.
Many countries have traditions as to the occupations of sons who don't inherit. Son #1 gets the land, son #2 joins the military, son #3 joins the clergy, son #4 studies at a university, etc.
R.A.
Many countries have traditions as to the occupations of sons who don't inherit. Son #1 gets the land, son #2 joins the military, son #3 joins the clergy, son #4 studies at a university, etc.
R.A.
Wilphe
Adventurer
What Storm Raven said.
It's very, very heavily dependent upon the culture and the society.
The unhelpful answer is: Whatever you want it to be
The more honest answer is: What RL society are you, however loosely, modelling your world on?
The British nobility was /is very small compared to the rest of Europe.
You are talking about 600 people or so with actual titles, below that you have a large, disparate group of people who are gentlefolk but aren't formally nobility.
Pre-revolution France had a noble class of somewhere in the 100,000+ range.
However, by no means all of those spent their time hanging out at Versailles.
A great many of them were often no richer than the peasents they lived amongst - but they did have the right to carry a sword; certain tax advantages and the exlcusive right to become army officers.
I believe in Italy inheritence was partible and you could have multiple people holding the same title - this can get confusing.
It's get even better when you consider that in France a title often goes with a property - so to become the Marquis de "X" you have to buy the Chateau de "X".
You can make this as complicated as you want. Descendents and relatives are normally considered to be gentle, if not noble - a lot however depends on how much money they have and what, if anything, they do for a living.
It's very, very heavily dependent upon the culture and the society.
The unhelpful answer is: Whatever you want it to be
The more honest answer is: What RL society are you, however loosely, modelling your world on?
The British nobility was /is very small compared to the rest of Europe.
You are talking about 600 people or so with actual titles, below that you have a large, disparate group of people who are gentlefolk but aren't formally nobility.
Pre-revolution France had a noble class of somewhere in the 100,000+ range.
However, by no means all of those spent their time hanging out at Versailles.
A great many of them were often no richer than the peasents they lived amongst - but they did have the right to carry a sword; certain tax advantages and the exlcusive right to become army officers.
I believe in Italy inheritence was partible and you could have multiple people holding the same title - this can get confusing.
It's get even better when you consider that in France a title often goes with a property - so to become the Marquis de "X" you have to buy the Chateau de "X".
You can make this as complicated as you want. Descendents and relatives are normally considered to be gentle, if not noble - a lot however depends on how much money they have and what, if anything, they do for a living.
