Is the Paladin a subclass or a main class?

[Arctic Wolf]

So hey everyone. Obviously as you can tell I am trying to gauge what people think of of the Paladin being it's own class or a subclass. I tried searching but all I could find was related to mages and their other offshots. This is mainly to help me with my homebrew since I am having problems making a case for the Paladin being it's own class and want to hear what the populace at Enworld think. I'm still debeating a few things, but aside from the poll, could you give me a reason as to why you think what you voted for? Thanks all!

 

[The Human Target]

It can be either.

Just depends on where you draw your class lines.

Also on what your priest/cleric is like.

No right answer.

 

[GSHamster]

The paladin doesn't fit nicely into a single inheritance hierarchy. If it is a subclass of a fighter, you then have to infuse it with cleric characteristics. And vice-versa if it is a subclass of the cleric.

So the easy solution is to say that it is its own class.

Now, if your structure allows multiple inheritance, such that one can say a paladin is both a fighter and a cleric, then that works best. But most game structures are not set up like that.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

It varies by edition. In 2e and earlier, it was just a variant fighter, but in 3e/PF and 4e it's a divine class with abilities that make it distinct from the fighter.

Although there's very little difference, beyond flavor, between a paladin and a "fighty" cleric. Not even smite; an NPC cleric with the Destruction and War domain, riding a celestial horse it conjured with Planar Ally, looks exactly like a paladin. Make them LG and they seem even more so.

 

[The Human Target]

It varies by edition. In 2e and earlier, it was just a variant fighter, but in 3e/PF and 4e it's a divine class with abilities that make it distinct from the fighter.

Although there's very little difference, beyond flavor, between a paladin and a "fighty" cleric. Not even smite; an NPC cleric with the Destruction and War domain, riding a celestial horse it conjured with Planar Ally, looks exactly like a paladin. Make them LG and they seem even more so.

This is true.

And a pally without magic stuff is just a fancy pigeonholed fighter.

So the 3rd option is no paladin.

Or paladin as a prestige class if that's an option.

 

[TerraDave]

In OD&D and 1E D&D, the paladin was a subclass of the fighter.

In 1E post UA, they became a subclass of cavelier.

In 2E, the paladin was a warrior, together with the fighter and ranger.

In BECMI, a fighter could become a paladin, though without a huge mechanical impact.

I think in fantasy craft (to jump ahead) a more basic warrior can also become a paladin.

Back to 3E, they got rid of sub-classes, as in 1E and 2E they had no real mechanical meaning.

In 4E, they have roles, so paladins became defenders, along with fighters, and later wardens, and some other classes.

Honestly, it depends on your overall approach to classes. In 1E, you could have an elf cleric/fighter or a human paladin, but they wheren't really the same. In 3E and 4E, with lots of options in play, yes you can make 1 class start to look like another, but that actually doesn't invalidate it as its own class.

 

[Scorpio616]

Paladin is a warrior fighting for Goodness and Right so hard the Folks Upstairs feel they owe the zealot some magic bennies.

Although there's very little difference, beyond flavor, between a paladin and a "fighty" cleric. Not even smite; an NPC cleric with the Destruction and War domain, riding a celestial horse it conjured with Planar Ally, looks exactly like a paladin. Make them LG and they seem even more so.

That is because the devs screwed up and let the cleric do waaaay too much.

 

[Ahnehnois]

I could see paladin as being a subclass of "warpriest" if there was one, or of the cleric.

 

[the Jester]

It depends on what you mean by "paladin" and "cleric" and "warrior" and "class" and "subclass".

In D&D, the paladin is clearly a class, and has been since 1e.

It's also a subclass of fighter in 1e and of warrior in 2e.

Define your terms and hopefully your answer will emerge.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

That is because the devs screwed up and let the cleric do waaaay too much.

I don't blame the cleric. The 4e cleric is far more limited than the 3e version, and the warpriest (either version) is still hard to distinguish from a paladin. Many of their encounter and utility powers are identical beyond flavor text.

The paladin's only unique ability is Divine Challenge (or Essentials equivalent, Righteous Radiance) and Lay on Hands.