Is this fair? -- your personal opinion

[ThirdWizard]

Wow, gizmo, you didn't use the word anime or video gamey once! I kid, I kid. I can see the humor in the newer style, even if I prefer it. I mean, I've been known to characture old school gmes once or twice in my time.

Besides, mohawks are out. It's all about the long flowing hair now. Or dreads.

 

[DonTadow]

That I do disagree with.

It's a playstyle decision that you have made. Why do you think it is universal?

I disagree with that too. If this statement were true, there would be a lot less adventurers. Who wants to adventure where every door was trapped. In that type of world, thieves would be far more abudnant than warriors and fighters are.

 

[Raven Crowking]

What does the SRD tell us?

Trap Floors

Some floors are designed to become suddenly dangerous. With the application of just the right amount of weight, or the pull of a lever somewhere nearby, spikes protrude from the floor, gouts of steam or flame shoot up from hidden holes, or the entire floor tilts. These strange floors are sometimes found in an arena, designed to make combats more exciting and deadly. Construct these floors as you would any other trap.​

This is an example of a lever doing something bad. Heck, this is an example of a whole lot of bad things levers can do.

A special door (see below for examples) might have a lock with no key, instead requiring that the right combination of nearby levers must be manipulated or the right symbols must be pressed on a keypad in the correct sequence to open the door.​

Hmmm. Here a lever does something good. This may, perhaps, supply a reason why the PCs in the OP might think that the lever and secret door are a combination?

Shifting Stone or Wall

These features can cut off access to a passage or room, trapping adventurers in a dead end or preventing escape out of the dungeon. Shifting walls can force explorers to go down a dangerous path or prevent them from entering a special area. Not all shifting walls need be traps. For example, stones controlled by pressure plates, counterweights, or a secret lever can shift out of a wall to become a staircase leading to a hidden upper room or secret ledge.

Shifting stones and walls are generally constructed as traps with triggers and Search and Disable Device DCs. However they don’t have Challenge Ratings because they’re inconveniences, not deadly in and of themselves.​

Hmmm...another bad thing that levers can do.

Apparatus of the Crab

This item appears to be a large, sealed iron barrel, but it has a secret catch (Search DC 20 to locate) that opens a hatch in one end. Anyone who crawls inside finds ten (unlabeled) levers: The device has the following characteristics: hp 200; hardness 15; Spd 20 ft., swim 20 ft.; AC 20 (-1 size, +11 natural); Atk +12 melee (2d8, 2 pincers).​

OK, this is a good thing that levers can do....but in this case they are part of something very specific.

Crossbow, Light

You draw a light crossbow back by pulling a lever. Loading a light crossbow is a move action that provokes attacks of opportunity.

Crossbow, Repeating

The repeating crossbow (whether heavy or light) holds 5 crossbow bolts. As long as it holds bolts, you can reload it by pulling the reloading lever (a free action). Loading a new case of 5 bolts is a full-round action that provokes attacks of opportunity.

You can fire a repeating crossbow with one hand or fire a repeating crossbow in each hand in the same manner as you would a normal crossbow of the same size. However, you must fire the weapon with two hands in order to use the reloading lever, and you must use two hands to load a new case of bolts.​

Again, pretty item specific.

"Lever" also shows up in the spell, telekinesis, which can specifically be used to operate a lever.

So, if we exclude ourselves to what is in the SRD, and if we know the lever is not part of a crossbow or an apparatus of the crab:

Good possibilities: Open a door, shift a wall to open a door.

Bad possibilities: Make spikes protrude from the floor, make gouts of steam or flame shoot up from hidden holes, make the entire floor tilt, trap you in a dead end, prevent escape out of the dungeon, force you to go down a dangerous path, or prevent you from entering a special area.

Do still you disagree that, within the concept of dungeons promulgated by the Core Rules, pulling a lever (unless it is part of your equipment) in a dungeon-like setting has a disproprtionate chance to make something bad happen?

 

[Raven Crowking]

I disagree with that too. If this statement were true, there would be a lot less adventurers. Who wants to adventure where every door was trapped. In that type of world, thieves would be far more abudnant than warriors and fighters are.

I didn't say that "every door was trapped". Actually, if you read my posts, you will see that I say repeatedly that there is a great deal of difference between the implications of levers and doors, and what one should expect from either.

RC

 

[ThirdWizard]

Even though the poll you made is biased, it seems that the "yes" votes have stayed slightly ahead of the "no" votes.

Just imagine what the poll would have been like had the vote you preferred had been the absolute.

Or if the poll had had an Other option, since all Others were naturally directed toward the No vote.

Or if you had stated that the rogue had found no traps on the lever.

Or if the question were "Should you leave a lever alone that you find in a dungeon?"

Ah well.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Even though the poll you made is biased, it seems that the "yes" votes have stayed slightly ahead of the "no" votes.

Thank you. I learned poll design from the tobacco industry.

I do note that, of the respondents who posted further, there are a number who view it likely that the lever is trapped/something bad will happen, but that the lever should still be pulled. Since I admitted earlier that I probably would have pulled the lever, although I knew it was probably trapped, this opens up all kinds of new and interesting questions.

(1) Is it a good thing to avoid traps? Or should you just let the trap be sprung?

(2) If you do pull the lever, knowing that it's probably a trap, and the trap kills you, is it your fault or the DM's?

After trying to answer those questions, we could look at the fairness question again in their light. But it is certainly true that a slim majority claim they would pull the lever, even if they knew it to be trapped.

RC

 

[Raven Crowking]

If I am to take what we are seeing here, combined with the poll about pulling levers, I would note how very close the numbers are between those who view the OP trap as being unfair, and those who said "Yes, pull the lever".....and there are numerous comments to the effect that you should pull the lever even if you know that it is likely to be trapped.

This then begs the question: Do people view this trap as unfair because it punishes pulling a lever? In other words, are lethal levers unfair?

RC

 

[Odhanan]

In other words, are lethal levers unfair?

Without any fair warning prior to seeing the lever? Yes. It's unfair.
Now, the whole question is IMO what constitutes a fair warning, and that will vary with each gaming groups and their capabilities in terms of deductions and style of play.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Now, the whole question is IMO what constitutes a fair warning, and that will vary with each gaming groups and their capabilities in terms of deductions and style of play.

Now, this I can certainly agree with.

RC