Is Wotc Slipping?

[Stormonu]

I was just recently ordering some things off Amazon, and out of curiousity, I decided to go look at the ranking for the most popular RPG products ( Books > Science Fiction and Fantasy > Gaming).

A bit to my surprise, The Pathfinder Core book was sitting in the #1 spot (about 10 PM Friday night 3/19/11). I checked again the next day, and PF is still there. (Whats even wierder is that four books of the so-called Morcyth saga, of which I've never heard, are on the list). It was very odd, as I've never before seen WotC's products fall out of the #1 spot.

What's also strange was at the time I was looking, the highest-ranked Wotc product on the list was the Dungeon Tiles, followed immediately by the starter set. The Rules Compenduim was somewhere in the 20s, and the 4E PHB was ranked below the PHB2 & 3. In each case, the Pathfinder product was placed ahead of the similar Wotc product (Bestiary ranked above Monster Vault, which ranked above the MM1/2/3, Advanced Players outranked Heroes of..., etc). I was very surpised to see the 3.5 PHB likewise in the top 20.


Since it is unlikely that WotC and Paizo will release direct sales numbers, are there any other places on the web to look up selling trends to see where WotC is sitting at in the sales rank?

 

[Dice4Hire]

I have little trust for Amazon sales rankings overall. There always seems to be something odd in the high ranks, especially in the low top ten. I'm sure WOTC's book sales have dropped a bit as there is nothing new, and has not been for a few months now.

Paizo, on the other hand, is putting out a steady steam of books.

But WOTC has DDI, which is not on Amazon's rankings at all.

I know of no good site to tell us real sales figures.

 

[kramer81]

Dice4Hire I think pretty much is right. WotC has not released a new gaming book since November (not including Dungeon Tiles or the Fortune Cards in that), and there isn't another one coming out for about a month.

My suggestion is wait till April 19th and see hoe Heroes of Shadow does then.

 

[S'mon]

The Pathfinder Core Rulebook does seem to be a consistent very high seller, considering it's been out for awhile now.

 

[DaveMage]

They may be slipping on amazon, but as others have said, amazon rankings are only valid on amazon, and only at the time you are looking at them.

Also, I think most of the gaming books are ranked 2,000+ overall on amazon, so it's likely if a particular product sells a few dozen in a short period, it can move the product up the ranks very quickly.

I think it does show that Pathfinder is selling decently on amazon, but beyond that, I don't think there's much you can conclude form those rankings.

 

[Keith Robinson]

It shouldn't be that surprising - at least, I'm not surprised by it. I was talking to the owner of our FLGS and she said that 4ed sales has 'tanked' (her words, not mine), while Pathfinder was still a steady seller.

While you can only speculate at the reasons, mine would be that WotC are reducing their visibility in the market place (less products, no longer supporting the RPGA, ending ddm, etc), while Pathfinder have shifted up a gear and are putting a lot of stuff out there. They've essentially plugged the hole left by WotC.

As others have said, WotC have the DDI and it is my opinion that they will concentrate their business model more and more around it, as I get the impression that it has been ver successful and brings in a constant stream of revenue. In the long term, this may be a good decision, but in the short to middle terms, it will likely have a negative impact on their market visibility IMO (and hence sales).

It will be interesting to see how Pathfinder continues to sell. They have a brand loyalty that WotC can only really dream of these days, but nonetheless there will (presuambly!) come a time when sales in their core products (Pathfinder core rules, bestiary, etc) will start to decline. The question is, will their AP sales be enough to sustain their revenue stream or will they, like TSR and WotC before them, be forced to think of a new edition?

It'll be interesting to watch and see.

 

[JeffB]

With the cost of the PF core book @ $50 priced normally, I can certainly see why it would remain at or near the top - that 30% off (and free shipping) really helps! I buy all my books (Gaming or otherwise) from Amazon when possible and that included my PF books.

 

[Matt James]

WotC has been shifting towards digital releases, while supporting FLGS with the encounters events. There is no good way of comparing sales, at all.

 

[Shemeska]

WotC has been shifting towards digital releases, while supporting FLGS with the encounters events. There is no good way of comparing sales, at all.

The next round or two of IcV2 (Q4 2010 and Q1 2011) should be quite interesting, even if it's only one segment of the market it looks at.

 

[Umbran]

A bit to my surprise, The Pathfinder Core book was sitting in the #1 spot (about 10 PM Friday night 3/19/11).

Amazon sales rankings reflect short term selling trends, not historical sales. So, if the book is selling well today, r this week, the ranking will be high today. Amazn does not make their ranking algorithm public, so exactly what it tells you is questionable.

It isn't supposed to be telling you how well the book is selling, actually giving you real and comprehensible information. It is intended as a marketing tool to get you to buy stuff from Amazon.

Since it is unlikely that WotC and Paizo will release direct sales numbers, are there any other places on the web to look up selling trends to see where WotC is sitting at in the sales rank?

Reliable ones, based on actual data? No. That's typically private business information.