issue with the spell target: you/creature

[Carrion_Buffet]

Their interpretation is so ludicrous that it's seemingly a lost cause to even explain it to them. I'd strongly suggest finding a new group, unless these people are friends. And then, just smack them until they stop acting silly.

This started with one group and migrated to my group...grrr! They are my friends so I guess I'm stuck

Like I said, I'll see if I can sucker...err...get them to defend there logic in here, lol, cause I hope the community can help them overcome this silly rules-mongering, plus I would love to see how the debate this silliness.

 

[moritheil]

Not at all. Many times a third party can be used to mediate an arguement between many. This is the main reason we have lawyers...well that and good jokes!

Well, I'm under the impression that you want to keep gaming with them. To do so means that you want them to be amicable. Most of the time, when lawyers get called in, things don't wind up amicable.

 

[hafrogman]

Best I can help you with is how a few lines later it talks about how you can declare yourself a willing target. Not a specific statement, but there aren't any spells that are both "willing target" AND "you"

Some spells restrict you to willing targets only. Declaring yourself as a willing target is something that can be done at any time (even if you’re flat-footed or it isn’t your turn). Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing, but a character who is conscious but immobile or helpless (such as one who is bound, cowering, grappling, paralyzed, pinned, or stunned) is not automatically willing.

 

[Carrion_Buffet]

Well, I'm under the impression that you want to keep gaming with them. To do so means that you want them to be amicable. Most of the time, when lawyers get called in, things don't wind up amicable.

I think they can take it. In the end once the debate is concluded everyone moves on to the next one...sigh.

 

[gnfnrf]

This one seems so incredibly obvious to me that I don't know how to argue it, except by absurdity.

But, after some digging, I found some rules text that does clearly assume that touch range spells can be cast on the caster.

In Complete Arcane, the Argent Savant's "Force Armor" ability discusses what happens when they cast mage armor on themselves. Obviously, for this to mean anything, they have to be able to cast mage armor on themselves.

Similarly, the Suel Archanamach discusses what happens when he casts bull's strength on himself.

I know it isn't much, but its hard to find rules which say things that obvious.

--
gnfnrf

 

[Carrion_Buffet]

Thank You that may do nicely! I ran into the same issue finding spells that spell it out in black and white. I found two in the PHB; Feather Fall and I think the other one is Dream.