Just *how* big is that gold piece again?

[Cedric]

I work it two ways...in a primarily rural setting (small towns, villages, dungeons, caves, adventures) most trade is done with barter. The passing around of large amounts of coin is rare (extremely rare) but it happens. Adventurers are likely the only ones who would have this much coin...

But in my game worlds like that I keep adventurers decidedly a cut above the rest of the populace. Something more of legend that kids dream of becoming but never will take the first steps to try because they are more sensible then that.

In my city based campaigns where things are very urban. I usually employ something like an Empire and a large Roman like city with separate sections and quarters and a very active thieve's guild and very prominent money lender's guild.

In those cities the coinage is stamped in a mint with Arcane Mark stamps that allow Money lender guild mages (or anyone with the pull to get the spell out of them) to track money and learn something of it's age and minting from looking at it with the spell running.

Cedric

 

[Altalazar]

Realistically perhaps yes, but then the average D&D PC hardly fits into the typical social and economic structure of feudal Europe. It's of small relevance if the D&D currency doesn't match the real world. In feudal Europe, the same peasant who would never see that gold piece also wouldn't go out into the world, pick up a sword or a spellbook and start battling orc hordes or raiding dungeons. Looking at D&D currency from the point of view of the great masses of 1st level commoners itsn't really that important, IMO.

I think we're seeing the source of a disconnect here. Usually, PCs are NOT peasants - with the exception of one character in one game - a fighter who fought with a pitchfork who was "Skip - the Peasant Hero".

I'm just talking about Peasants here. Peasants should never see gold coins, and silver coins to peasants should be like seeing a years pay all at once. So the PCs, to be "rich" have bags filled with a "whopping" few hundred silver coins or even a dozen or so gold coins.

 

[Dogbrain]

I'm just talking about Peasants here. Peasants should never see gold coins, and silver coins to peasants should be like seeing a years pay all at once.

According to the Beveridge Wage and Price History Collection, Box A.32 (Winchester Manorial Wages), a plain nobody agricultural day laborer in Winchester could expect between 1 to 1.5 pence per day in cash wages. Day laborers were not entitled to payment of clothing, food, or lodging, so they had to be paid in coin. This was a bad bargain for them, since usually things purchased in coin were more "expensive" than if they got it as part of their "compensation package". To make matters worse for them, they could not expect year-round employment, either.

A full-time unskilled town laborer could expect to see nothing more than about a pound (240 pence), if that much. Skilled rural labor, like a thatcher's assistant, could fetch tuppence a day.

In the cities, a weaver of about the same era could expect up to five pounds sterling per year (1200 pence). A master mason could demand more than that. A master carpenter could get almost as much as a master mason, and a sick journeyman carpenter could get tuppence per day as a stipend from the guild.

Heavy infantry got the pay of a master mason. Minor officers (esquires, constables, etc.) got twice that. Landless knights' mercenary pay was again double.

It is estimated that Earls could get 400-11000 pounds sterling cash income--but then that had to be used to maintain their private armies.

Thus, it is easy to see that peasants should not consider a single silver coin to be a year's wages.

 

[kigmatzomat]

I'm just talking about Peasants here. Peasants should never see gold coins, and silver coins to peasants should be like seeing a years pay all at once. So the PCs, to be "rich" have bags filled with a "whopping" few hundred silver coins or even a dozen or so gold coins.

Then you need to seriously revamp the cost of items. A night of mild drinking at the inn will burn though a silver or two, more if they eat at the inn. And that isn't duck a l'orange and a nice chateau brien, it's cheese and stew with ale. They won't do this daily, or even weekly, but once a month they'll blow off steam with a few ales at the commonhouse.

Personally, I'd have something like the pound-sterling that takes the place of the gp (100cp) and the gp becomes a 1,000cp coin. Heck, I'd call it the tupound (100sp=2lbs) and go with that.

 

[Dogbrain]

Then you need to seriously revamp the cost of items. A night of mild drinking at the inn will burn though a silver or two, more if they eat at the inn.

Some stuff from my historical sources:

Wine: 3d to 10d per gallon
Ale: 0.75d to 1.5d per gallon
Dried fruit: 1d to 4d per pound
Spices: 1s to 3s per pound
Peppercorns: 4s or more per pound
Saffron: 12s or more per pound
Cow: 6s to 10s
Ewe: 1s to 2s
Pig: 2s to 3s
Chicken: 1/2d
Egg: 1/24d each
Goose: 6d to 8d (in London—big city, big prices)

1d= 1 penny (1/240 a pound sterling)
1s= 1 shilling (12 pence)

And to add to what I posted on wages, official status and wages were not always tied together. In one armory, an "Old Martin" made about 12% more than did the guy who was supposedly in charge of it. I guess skill counted for something back then.

 

[The Lone Badger]

I think of them as about the size of a sequin - given the way PCs seem to carry around hundreds of the things in their pockets.

 

[kirinke]

i think the size of the coins are like this:

platinum piece: about the size of the US gold eagle coin

Electrum piece: about the size of a susan b anthony coin

gold piece: about the size of a sacagawea coin (i murdered the spelling, off with my head. NOOOO!)

silver piece: about the size of a us quarter
copper piece: about the size of a us penny or nickle.

there. that makes it a bit more feasible to have 50gp in your pocket.

 

[Treebore]

I personally go the old Roman route. One of the Best of Dragons (#4, I believe) had an article in it where it pointed out that roman coins numbered around 120 coins per pound, for the gold coins. All the roman coins i have, whether copper, silver, or gold, are all about the size and thickness of a dime with very rough edges. So i just ruled that there are 100 coins per pound of gold, silver, and copper. Granted, due to the varying densities of each metal, this isn't wholly realistic, but this is where I decided it is fantasy after all.

Now as far as bringing a fantasy game economy in line with a realistic one. It is a headeache not worth getting. The closest i have come is by making food and simple clothing very cheap, as well as farm implements. Everything a "peasant" would need to survive is worth only coppers at full "retail". Adventuring and high class items are made of the finest and the rarest whenever possible. Therefore far to expensive for any "peasant" to ever own legitimately, and if they do own it they better have it well documented by offcials as to how they came to own it.

So essentially i have two economic scales, one for the poor and one for the rich. Not too far off from reality, really. But still simple enough for me to at least hint at the disparity between the poor and the rich on a regular basis. This has led several players off on a "help the poor and downtrodden" storyline. But most ignore it, just like in real life.