Thomasrivers
First Post
Thanks Everyone for your suggestions
Hey Thanks I am going to use alot of your Ideas.
Thomasrivers
Hey Thanks I am going to use alot of your Ideas.
Thomasrivers
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Keep Magic Rare
- Thread starter Thomasrivers
- Start date
One way to make magic a lil more difficult / rare is to ditch Spellcraft and Knowledge Arcana, and instead introduce Conjuration, Abjuration, Evocation, Divination, etc as class skills for wizards and sorcerors. At each level, calculate the maximum number of ranks a character can have in each of the skills. For every point their actual ranks is below their maximum rank, shave off one level of magic that they can learn from that school.
So- Level 12 Wizard- Max ranks for skills = 15. In order to cast 6th level spells from Evocation, he requires at least 12 ranks in Evocation. To be able to have the option to cast all the spells he gets at that level which normally he could use, assuming 8 schools (not counting Universal), he'll need a good 96 skill points divided amongst all those schools. Only a Wizard with 22 Int could keep up with every school.
What this does, is instead of making magic totally rare, is forcing wizards to choose exactly what they wish to be good at and what they could care less about. Accessibility translates to presence, and without presence, magic is quite rare. Except for the Archmage types who insist on knowing everything... hat's off to them if they can actually keep up with this formula. As this method also can result in Wizards losing their powers if they don't keep up with their leveling through skill distribution, it also sets the stage for a campaign where magic is a fleeting power that evades the dim and escapes the strong. Spellbooks become books of memories and all that fun stuff. Additionally, those truly devoted to magic are somewhat addleminded, keeping to their books so intently that they know little of religion, politics, or their immediate environment as cross-class skills like spot atrophy.
So- Level 12 Wizard- Max ranks for skills = 15. In order to cast 6th level spells from Evocation, he requires at least 12 ranks in Evocation. To be able to have the option to cast all the spells he gets at that level which normally he could use, assuming 8 schools (not counting Universal), he'll need a good 96 skill points divided amongst all those schools. Only a Wizard with 22 Int could keep up with every school.
What this does, is instead of making magic totally rare, is forcing wizards to choose exactly what they wish to be good at and what they could care less about. Accessibility translates to presence, and without presence, magic is quite rare. Except for the Archmage types who insist on knowing everything... hat's off to them if they can actually keep up with this formula. As this method also can result in Wizards losing their powers if they don't keep up with their leveling through skill distribution, it also sets the stage for a campaign where magic is a fleeting power that evades the dim and escapes the strong. Spellbooks become books of memories and all that fun stuff. Additionally, those truly devoted to magic are somewhat addleminded, keeping to their books so intently that they know little of religion, politics, or their immediate environment as cross-class skills like spot atrophy.
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I've employed many of these ideas in my campaign of the last two years or so, and I think they work very well. It's especially useful to keep magic users rare demographically, so you can maintain some consistency between the world and the system.
One further wrinkle in my world: magic items don't cost experience, they cost hit points. Charged items (potions, scrolls, wands) have the hit point loss heal back very slowly; permanent items (such as weapons, rings, and other "always on" items) require a permanent sacrifice of hit points.
Usually, a magic item is created as the last act of a poweful wizard, or by evil people (who use other's hit points to create items, often leading to curses, evil weapons, and so on). That system allows for more common minor items, then a big jump to vastly powerful (but rare and dangerous) items.
One further wrinkle in my world: magic items don't cost experience, they cost hit points. Charged items (potions, scrolls, wands) have the hit point loss heal back very slowly; permanent items (such as weapons, rings, and other "always on" items) require a permanent sacrifice of hit points.
Usually, a magic item is created as the last act of a poweful wizard, or by evil people (who use other's hit points to create items, often leading to curses, evil weapons, and so on). That system allows for more common minor items, then a big jump to vastly powerful (but rare and dangerous) items.
the_bruiser
First Post
Coredump said:
I am actually doing this, and awarding less gold, in my campaign - we're 20-odd sessions in (10th-12th level) and it's working wonderfully. The best weapon and armor held by anyone are +2, with no special enhancements. Only two stat-boosting items have been found.
In adventures at this level, instead of teleporting all over, raising allies from the dead, etc., we're still traveling on foot/horseback, curing people the slow way, and burying our lost companions. Don't get me wrong - the characters are getting to be studs, but it's not through high-level magic that they're doing it. Because nobody is an uber-priest or -mage, everybody is forced to have some melee capability, so it's a lot more fun in that regard too, for me as a DM.
I have a word doc with a more comprehensive list of our house rules in this regard if anyone is interested.
I've found that, in general, a CR reduction of ~2-3 appears to be appropriate at these levels - probably about a 25% CR reduction, according to level, both due to less magic possessed by character, and the fact that the party has no high-level casters (which in turn makes you not really able to throw certain types of opponents at the party).
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Tuzenbach
First Post
Incorporate NPCs whose sole function is to hunt down spellcasters and kill them.
Create a PrC that's akin to a Ranger except that their function is to destroy spellcasters. Make it be desireable enough that your players want to work their way towards assuming the role, i.e., limited magic resistance that gets better with level advancement, the ability to "see magic" on either items or persons, greater "to hit" & damage against spellcasters, etc.
Create a PrC that's akin to a Ranger except that their function is to destroy spellcasters. Make it be desireable enough that your players want to work their way towards assuming the role, i.e., limited magic resistance that gets better with level advancement, the ability to "see magic" on either items or persons, greater "to hit" & damage against spellcasters, etc.
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