Knockback

[Thanee]

Don't you also think it's weird that, if your fighter gets hit by that ancient dragon, he will not be knocked back?

Maybe incorporating something like an automatic bull rush or something similar to trip (using grapple checks maybe) would be cool to use in such a situation (getting slammed by something really big)?

Bye
Thanee

 

[hong]

Don't you also think it's weird that, if your fighter gets hit by that ancient dragon, he will not be knocked back?

Yes.

90% of the splatbook feats are stupid, and this is one of them.

 

[Varius]

You can either use the large and in charge feat from S&F, or the feat I made http://test.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=12074

 

[Crothian]

Re: Re: Knockback

Yes.

90% of the splatbook feats are stupid, and this is one of them.

You're thinking of knockdown. He's talking about just getting swatted backwards when hit.

It does seem like physics would require it, but it really is not easy to get a good rules base for it. How do you determine who has a chance to knock something back? Is it based off of size or strength? And how do you determine how afar one is knocked back? Is there a way to resit it?

 

[hong]

Re: Re: Re: Knockback

You're thinking of knockdown. He's talking about just getting swatted backwards when hit.

Same thing, really. The fact that the D&D rules distinguish between getting knocked down and getting knocked back doesn't mean the underlying rationale isn't the same -- a big hit that leaves you reeling. The problem is in trying to reconcile the concept of a "big hit" with D&D's hit point system.

 

[Ruvion]

And hit points do not accurately tell you which part of you got clipped, wacked, or even if it was a miss (since Hit Points does not always detail a hit)...Since depending on which side you got hit (or not hit), you could get knocked back, sideways, or even down.

 

[SamB]

Is it really that complicated? How about this:

Come up with a percentage of remaining HP (say 50%).
Damage equal to or greater to that threshold knocks the character back 5' and requires a Balance check (dc10?) to avoid getting knocked prone.

This can get really nasty when fighting on stairs or narrow causeways, etc. "Well, you survived the blow from the Ogre's club, but now you've just fallen off the 100' cliff!"

If you wanted more detail, I'd suggest:

1) Limit both the type of damge that causes knockback. A sword blow or a Bigby's hand type spell will knock you over, but a lightning bolt or cone of cold would not.

2) A dagger thrust, arrow, or a halfling kicking an Ogre isn't likely to cause knockback (unless you want extremely cinematic action). The weapon or attacker (in the case of natural weapons and unarmed strikes) must be the same size as the target or larger to cause knockback. This means that a halfling can send a human flying, but needs to use a medium-sized weapon to do it.

3) Add 5' for every size difference between the weapon/attacker and the target. This means that a human getting smacked by a Greatsword would fly 10', while a Halfling getting swatted by Huge Red Dragon (4 sizes difference) would be hurled 25'! Each extra 5' adds +5 to the DC as well. This means that our unfortunate Halfling friend is going to have to make a Balance check of DC30 to stay on his feet after his airborne display.

4) Come up with an absolute damage threshold, say 10 points, below which knockback doesn't happen no matter what. This keeps relatively glancing blows from chucking characters in the air at low HP.

 

[Impeesa]

Any successful physical attack knocks back a number of feet equal to the amount by which the damage exceeds the target's strength. The target is not knocked prone unless they are thrown back farther than their normal move rate. Just off the top of my head there, seems simple enough (although any mage foolish enough to get near the front is going to do a lot of flying).

--Impeesa--

 

[JDRay]

Why does getting knocked back have to be tied to damage induced? I realize that there's a certain relationship, but, particularly where cinematic or swashbuckling style play is at hand, getting knocked back shouldn't do more than making you vulnerable to an AoO.

On the other hand, flying through the air and hitting the ground should do some damage unless you have Tumble.

It seems that a system could be designed that takes into account size difference to determine whether or not a Terrasque can punt a halfling, and whether or not the halfling can avoid the damage with a good Tumble check. Furthermore, for barroom brawl situations, someone with a high strength (say Odge, Bar5/Ftr2 with a STR of 26) can hit someone in the breastplate (Cyph, Rog4/Sor2 with a DEX of 21) that weighs in around 105 pounds and send them flying.

Odge: "You steal from me! I kill you!"
Cyph: "~Sleep~ "
Odge (makes save): "Odge no sleep, clobber you!"

Wham! Cyph goes flying fifteen feet back, but turns it into a cartwheel and tumbles out the door. He takes the 13 points of damage from Odge hitting him in the chest, but he's otherwise unhurt. Had he not made the Tumble check, he would've hit the floor for an additional ?d? points of damage.

 

[kramis]

champions

I used to play Champions a long time ago and they had fun rules for knockback ... it was all part of the super hero rollplaying, an important part. you rarely did lethal damage but you often knocked your opponent through walls. it was quite fun actually.