Longsword Finesse bummer

[Benly]

No, you can't- warlocks can't use rapiers as implements, but they can use Pact Swords if they're Eladrin.

Rapiers, as light blades, qualify to be enchanted as Pact Blades.

 

[Ximenes088]

Rapiers, as light blades, qualify to be enchanted as Pact Blades.

Hmm- that is true. Looks like it's going to require a more exotic combo to justify in that case.

 

[Zsig]

There are two things people here are forgetting:

-Longswords are versatile, rapiers are not (which won't make any difference if you use a weapon on the off-hand). (still 2.5 average damage behind).

-Heavy blades can be enchanted with other kinds of properties... Vorpal, for instance can't be applied to light blades.


I'm not saying though that Longsword Finesse is any better than WP (Rapier), in fact, I still think it's worse.

 

[WalterKovacs]

It's mostly an issue of flavor. Dwarves and Eldarin get their own "special" version of the feat that allows you to use a mace for the rogue stuff. The mace is 1d8 and versatile ...

Also, there is always the issue of you may not always be able to get your sneak attack damage. For the purposes of someone multiclassing INTO rogue, where you only get to sneak attack once per encounter anyway, this feat is much easier to take. Being able to stick with your primary weapon for whatever your initial class and still be able to use all the rogue powerswaps you may have taken.

 

[Benly]

It's mostly an issue of flavor. Dwarves and Eldarin get their own "special" version of the feat that allows you to use a mace for the rogue stuff. The mace is 1d8 and versatile ...

Worthy of note, however, is that the dwarven version can be applied to waraxes and craghammers, both of which are much better than any light blade (in terms of raw numbers; feats are of course another issue.) The eladrin version applies only to longswords.

If eladrin longsword feats applied to heavy blades in general the same way dwarven feats apply to axes and hammers in general, it would go a long way towards catching them up..

 

[DracoSuave]

Eladrin don't really need catching up tho--Aren't they a +2 Dex race?

Eladrin get automagic proficiency with the longsword, so this feat allows them to use that racial trait with their class. That's all it does, and all it needs to do. Good on them for printing it.

 

[jasin]

Eladrin don't really need catching up tho--Aren't they a +2 Dex race?

Eladrin get automagic proficiency with the longsword, so this feat allows them to use that racial trait with their class.

... at a 1 die penalty to sneak attack damage.

"You are now able to benefit from your racial trait... sort of, have a -1d6 to damage" seems like a rather lackluster feat, don't you think?

 

[DracoSuave]

... at a 1 die penalty to sneak attack damage.

"You are now able to benefit from your racial trait... sort of, have a -1d6 to damage" seems like a rather lackluster feat, don't you think?

Depends on the situation.

If the situation is "I only care about my at-wills" then you might have a point there.
If the situation is "I want my Eladrin Sword-and-Board Fighter/Multi-Class Rogue to use his Longsword with Eladrin Soldier early game, Vorpal late game then using my Rogue powers to do massive x[W] damage at higher levels" then you might not have a point there.
If the situation is "I just want to be a longsword using Rogue" then you definately do not have a point there.

Not all feats exist to make your character into the six-million dollar man. Some of them exist so roleplayers can get their flavor on. Judge the feat on who and what it was made for, not for only one purpose.

 

[Benly]

Eladrin get automagic proficiency with the longsword, so this feat allows them to use that racial trait with their class. That's all it does, and all it needs to do. Good on them for printing it.

Yeah, they get to spend a feat to make use of that no-feat-cost bonus proficiency, at a penalty. That's.. that's a great deal there, guys.

There isn't (or shouldn't be) a binary of flavor feats vs. functional feats. When you do that, what you're saying is "players who want to make their characters flavorful should be penalized when the dice start hitting the table". A feat being bad isn't "justified" by it being flavorful - there's no reason the feat couldn't have been good along with being equally flavorful, and making that tradeoff in feat design serves only to create a trap for players who want to make flavorful characters.

Personally, I would take off the -1d6 of sneak attack damage. The feat is then at its core statistically similar to Weapon Proficiency: Rapier, with the change from a light blade to a heavy blade flavored by your race choice. You lose Nimble Blade, you gain Heavy Blade Opportunity and Eladrin Soldier.

 

[DracoSuave]

AND weapon enchantments based on heavy blades, such as Vorpal.

Vorpal is awesome.