D&D 5E Magic Initiate feat spell + Warlock spell slot?

[Tormyr]

It seems like this could be similar to the innate casting from monsters? They can have spells with their innate casting that are not in their regular spell list (the mind flayer is an example).

I could also see a magic user getting that spell and being able to use existing spell slots for it.

For me, a definitive ruling would require knowing how the spell was learned. If it is something innate, I might go with the innate spellcasting route and not allow spell slots to be used. If it is something learned through study, prayer, communing with nature, etc. then I would allow existing spell slots to be used as well. The 1/day becomes a bonus casting at the lowest level. Barring knowledge of how the spell was learned, I would probably lean toward allowing spell slots.

 

[steeldragons]

My possible takes on the slots issue is either:
1) The feat, by its nature, gives you a slot (1 1st level slot) with which to cast this spell you have learned. i.e. "You become a [very minor] spellcaster."
2) The feat, by its nature, does not require a slot with which to "cast" this innate spell/magical power you have learned. "You become a [very minor] innate magic-user."

Either way, plus the "once per long rest" stipulation, neither of these allow for "any slot you have can be used"...for either RAW or RAI.

 

[Jaelommiss]

In my games I treat the new spell as a once per day ability, without consuming spell slots. I also do not allow the spell to be cast additional times using the character's other spell slots.

If the feat required some level of spell casting before taking it then I would be more likely to require the use of a spell slot. As it is, a martial class could take this feat and it is unnecessarily punishing (in my mind) to them to not allow them to cast the spell because they do not have any slots.

Where is says that 'you learn [the] spell', I assume that it means that it is learned in reference to its once per day casting and not making the spell generally available.

I am considering allowing classes that have known spells (bard, eldritch knight, ranger, arcane trickster, sorcerer, warlock) to let the learned spell count against their total in exchange for being able to cast it additional times per day. Using it at higher levels would probably also be allowed, though I would make it clear that I would disallow it if there were complaints that other players thought it was too powerful. This would be a houserule and is not supported in any way by the book.

 

[Henrix]

I can't see how a spellcaster learning another level one spell at the cost of a feat could be too powerful.

If you take a level wizard you can add any number of level one spells to your spell book, and use with you warlock slots.

The feat is evidently not written to be taken by spellcasters.

 

[Sacrosanct]

I can't see how a spellcaster learning another level one spell at the cost of a feat could be too powerful.
.

It's because you're almost getting the benefit of a multiclass level dip without having to do so. If you are a warlock, you can get a cure wounds spell for example, and cast it at your current level in the higher slot without needing to actually spend the level dip to do so. I can see where that might cause problems.

 

[Ahrimon]

It's because you're almost getting the benefit of a multiclass level dip without having to do so. If you are a warlock, you can get a cure wounds spell for example, and cast it at your current level in the higher slot without needing to actually spend the level dip to do so. I can see where that might cause problems.

If you are any casting class you can take a 1 level dip into cleric and cast cure wounds at your highest slot level. But you also gain more spells as well as other class features and delay your regular class features a level. For a feat, one spell and two cantrips seems about right.

 

[Sacrosanct]

If you are any casting class you can take a 1 level dip into cleric and cast cure wounds at your highest slot level. But you also gain more spells as well as other class features and delay your regular class features a level. For a feat, one spell and two cantrips seems about right.

What other class features at level 1 though? Most classes don't really get many of them until level 2 or 3. And in order to get just the level 1, you have to spend an entire level for it. That's a big deal because you're giving up the advancement in your core class (which in the warlock's case could mean one less invocation, a lower spell level power, one less spell slot, etc). With the feat, you don't give up any of that. That's why I interpret it as literally written, and don't think you can use that spell in higher slots from your core class.

 

[Ahrimon]

What other class features at level 1 though? Most classes don't really get many of them until level 2 or 3. And in order to get just the level 1, you have to spend an entire level for it. That's a big deal because you're giving up the advancement in your core class (which in the warlock's case could mean one less invocation, a lower spell level power, one less spell slot, etc). With the feat, you don't give up any of that. That's why I interpret it as literally written, and don't think you can use that spell in higher slots from your core class.

I don't have the book with me right now, so I can't say what all a cleric multiclass get's at level one. But whether it's cleric, wizard, sorcerer, etc the character will potentially gain access to every 1st level spell of the class plus any other class ability that comes along with level one. In return they delay the abilities of their current class. I think there is way more to be gained from multiclassing than is lost in that light. So using a feat, the equivalent of +2 to an ability score, to gain access to one first level spell and two cantrips does not seem overpowered to me.

 

[green_destiny]

The wording on this one could be better, it doesn't seem as if the spell chosen is considered a new 'known' spell for your Warlock. However, it does say 'you learn it and can cast it once per day', but it also says that after you cast it, you must complete a long rest before you cast it again. I suppose the last part may only apply to the 1/day cast, but probably open to DM interpretation. The and in the feat description doesn't necessarily mean 'in addition to' though. Mike Mearls says that 'it wouldn't break anything' here. Note that I'm interpreting the feat in the most minimalist fashion possible, I think most DMs would let you get away with it.

Thanks for the link!

Anyway reading thru the comments I agree that doing multi class will give you a lot more benefit than this feat. I also dont intend to state that this feat will mimic multiclassing. But I get the point of discussing this if casting the extra learned spell in a warlock spell slot is OP for a feat.

Just to note i 'need' the shocking grasp cantrip thats why i choose to pick from the sorcerer class (CHA based ability like with a warlock and i intend to get the lvl1 Sleep spell aiming to can cast it using a warlock spell slot and gain it back after a short rest.

 

[Sacrosanct]

I don't have the book with me right now, so I can't say what all a cleric multiclass get's at level one. But whether it's cleric, wizard, sorcerer, etc the character will potentially gain access to every 1st level spell of the class plus any other class ability that comes along with level one. In return they delay the abilities of their current class. I think there is way more to be gained from multiclassing than is lost in that light. So using a feat, the equivalent of +2 to an ability score, to gain access to one first level spell and two cantrips does not seem overpowered to me.

You have to look at it in terms of everything gained for that level, not just the feat.

Option 1:
Gain first level spell and two cantrips (via the feat)
Gain one of the following: extra invocation, extra spell slot, spells cast at a higher slot
Possibly gain a patron benefit
Gain one new spell from your spell list

or

Option 2:
Gain access to all level 1 cleric spells
gain a level 1 divine domain
gain medium armor and shield prof
delay access to a patron benefit by one level
delay access to one of the following: extra invocation, extra spell slot, spells cast at a higher slot
delay access to one new spell from your spell list


That is why in my interpretation, you would not be able to gain the spell for the feat to be cast at any spell level slot because you're not giving up anything, whereas if you spend a level to multiclass in order to gain that ability (using spells at any slot), you're giving up quite a lot for not many other benefits.