Making big fights with weak monsters fun.

[Reynard]

In my most recent session of the MWP DragonLance campaign (modules) I am running, the PCs entered a chamber in Sla-Mori that contained 52 zombies. What I thought would be a cool, Dawn of the Dead style tension fest turned out to be a snoozer while the PCs moved them down 5 or so per round among them, with me rolling dice just to see if the zombies critted (and therefore hit). The wizard didn't even bother to contribute because while a fireball would have taken out a bunch of them, it was a waste of a spell.

Part of the problem was the layout (it is a long hall with no exits and the zombies attack once the PCs enter, so they basically form a wall and go). But the battlefield was only part of the problem. Part of it was likely my DMing, and part of it was certainly the system.

How do you make a big fight with lots of (relatively) weak adversaries interesting?

[insert obligatory contentious 4th Edition statement here to generate responses]

 

[KrazyHades]

Well, you can slightly modify the zombies to make them less weak by:
Upping their toughness

Allowing them to fight with 3 in one 5 by 5 foot space, all threatening: 1 character surrounded by the maximum zombies is dealing with 24 zombies each of which has +6 to hit from flanking (if you give the zombies the ability to stack flanking bonuses)

Giving their claws a chance to give disease


Of course, if you don't want to make them stronger, but instead want the basic zombies to be more dangerous, I'm not sure what to do. The problem with zombies is they can only take 1 action per round, so even if they surround people, they will all die out before they can actually attack the person they managed to surround.

 

[javcs]

Have the zombies wait until the party is roughly centered in the hall. I'd give the DC to sport the zombies before the surprise round a substantial boost - after all, they've been standing there for how many decades/centuries? They've had the time.

Standard action in the surprise round should be used to make a charge - multiple zombies from each size - after the first couple, it's a +4 bonus on their attacks, +2 from charging, +2 from flanking.

Another option would be replace them with different undead - advanced wights are usually good in that role.

Add an unhallow and a desecrate effect to the area. You could tweak the bonuses slightly so that they stack (both are profane as written).


Consider giving the zombies a bonus on grappling if several of them attempt to do so in the same round - especially if the character is surrounded. Maybe a +2 or so bonus on the checks per zombie attempting to grapple.

 

[KingCrab]

The original poster is asking how to make big fights with weak monsters fun. Upping the level of the monsters isn't really a solution.

I'm not sure it can be done unless it's sort of a fast battle where the players get to show off how far they've come.

 

[Digital M@]

Area attacks instead of targeted attacks can work. Take kobolds or goblins for example. Have a group of 5 of them target a 5' square and require a reflex save for half damage. To make it fair you can make one goblin a commander that is organizing the attacks, if the PCs can figure out who the commander is then they win an advantage by taking out the area attack. Create gaps in the environment such as a chasm, raised areas where the archers are, they can be behind half cover. make a few of them tougher with levels. Bull rush with the numbers to drag the PCs down. Keep track of the rounds of combat and look at the rules for fatigue, they can really benefit a DM and create a need to retreat.

 

[Cabled]

Well, your situation was the worst of all worlds because you had weak UNTHINKING monsters...D&D zombies are not "dawn of the dead type"..or maybe PC's are just not the stand around and get eaten type..but either way that classic movie scene doesn't play out well beyond about 4th level.

Weaker smart monsters are a little better, but they can't just trade blows...that's like attacking a tank with a baseball bat. The little guys have to gang up, they have to trip and tackle. Get 3 or 4 goblins all grabbing up a spear and charging, reverse tug-of-war style, and give'm a +2 hit and damage...or a dozen or more of them running circles around the party while holding both ends of a rope. The farther you get from "You swing, they swing", the more ad-libbing you need to do, but that is what it takes to even the playing field. And eventually, even that fails and the PC's really just do outpower the little guys.

 

[Piratecat]

Well, this evening I challenged a group of lvl 22-23 PCs with 2 HD kobolds. The kobolds has a "rot" template (basically could vomit green slime once per day) and were manning a trapped corridor. If it wasn't for good party teamwork, we would have lost one or two PCs.

For zombies, I'm a huge fan of the grapple rules (maybe a little simplified for a team of zombies working together) combined with the Green Ronin Advanced Bestiary template that allows zombie to eat brains from anyone they grapple. Getting held down by eight brain-munching zombies definitely gets a player's attention!

 

[joeandsteve]

Use the mob template?

 

[Stalker0]

Use the mob template?

Seconded on this one. The key is that the mob template does automatic damage, meaning your party will have to take them out quickly in order to risk the damage that will follow.

 

[blargney the second]

Zombie mob - nice! I'll have to check that one out when I get home.