Making combat more challenging: increase monster level or monster number?

[cmbarona]

Ah, cool. I keep hearing good things about the DMG2, and I could definitely use info like this. Maybe I should grab myself a copy. I hear they also have guidelines for creating traps, which is something I've wanted for a while now.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

There is a whole section on traps. It doesn't change anything radically but they go into a bit more detail about trap use and types of traps and such. There are a whole bunch of new traps as well which when you add that to what was in the first DMG means you have a LOT of pre-made traps to choose from.

 

[ren1999]

I started a monster construction kit thread. I did not see your request initially.

 

[nijineko]

A quick question from the DMs perspective. When designing encounters, I like to challenge my players. I notice that the standard encounter (Level=N) is a bit of a pushover for experienced players, so I'd like to create a bigger challenge for them. However, I'm worried about taking this to an extreme.

To give a little background:

I play in a game where the DM frequently uses the standard encounter XP budget, and in his old 3.5 fashion, frequently uses a series of lower-level standard monsters in order to fill out the encounter. What ends up happening from a player's perspective is that they are more of a nuisance than a challenge.

At the same time, I recently tried to challenge my group and made them face a series of level N+3 opponents and the Ranger ended up griping the whole time because it was so difficult for him to hit (to his benefit, I didn't plan well for the enemies' AC and to-hit reducing abilities). My bad, time to learn from my mistake.

So... advice? Should I keep higher-level opponents and just keep a closer eye on the inherent math? Or should I use same-level monsters but throw more of them at the players? What are the benefits and/or complications of each approach?

the real answer is variety.

mix it up. throw a bunch of mooks at them one time (use mob tactics and aid another on grapples and bullrush and trample), then throw a mid-level with some support types, then throw a high level pair at them, then change it up again for next time.

mix monster abilities in interesting fashions: if you have a grappler/thrower type, then mix it with a rust monster. the one will toss opponents to the rust monster which just waits for goodies to come its way.
use a lot of flying tiny types with polearms... that'll fit upwards of 30-80 opponents into a mob attack: for every one that attacks, 3 or 4 or 10 use aid another to assist the attack. That's +6, +8, or +20 to attack.
use the terrain to advantage, animals and insects do... so should monsters. blink dogs and quicksand? small air elementals and ankegs in the desert?

this will keep things interesting. oh, and don't worry if they tromp the occasional encounter - it makes the players feel good.

and then remember tucker's kobolds! the sublime way of dealing with mid to high level pcs. =D


(http://www.tuckerskobolds.com/)

 

[jodyjohnson]

4th Edition Thread Necromancy.

Specific to 4e more is better, for other editions there's more flexibility.

The flexibility in 4e is whether you use Minions, Normal, Elites, or Solos in addition to level as a difficulty gauge.