D&D General Maps in adventures: Top-down or Isometric

[Dioltach]

I love isometric, but I've never got the hang of drawing them.

 

[Baldurs_Underdark]

We have the minis on the table on a grid (which is pre-drawn and cannot be erased), so top-down is the only way.

 

[UngainlyTitan]

I play almost exclusively on VTT and Isometric are a pain in the ass.

 

[Shiroiken]

Isometric is useful as a detail on hard to describe elevation changes, but overall top-down is far more useful.

 

[el-remmen]

Isometric is useful as a detail on hard to describe elevation changes, but overall top-down is far more useful.

What he said. Top-down with inset isometric portions when necessary to show some detail.

 

[billd91]

For my preferences, it depends on the dungeon. The isometric maps in the original Ravenloft were a fantastic help for me understanding the vertical relationships between locations. But I don't think they'd be that helpful in other maps without a lot of elevation changes.

 

[Retreater]

Isometric maps are almost worthless. Can't use them on VTT, can't recreate them in person, can't even see the entire dungeon layout as the DM, unclear when showing how areas connect.

 

[Malmuria]

Isometric maps are almost worthless. Can't use them on VTT, can't recreate them in person, can't even see the entire dungeon layout as the DM, unclear when showing how areas connect.

Well I wouldn't say "worthless." One thing I think about is how the reliance on top down maps (from the beginning) encourages dungeons that are relatively flat. You can have levels, but they are basically arranged like stories in a building. This is odd especially when it comes to something like caverns or the underdark, where you should have constant slopes, pits, connections, etc, but for ease of use it gets translated into something more more flat. I'm not sure isometric maps solve this problem, but they can help with something that is relatively small scale.

Or, consider something like level design in a videogame. One thing I love about dark souls is the complexity of the spaces. But it's a hard thing to translate to a functional dnd game.

 

[Lanefan]

Well I wouldn't say "worthless." One thing I think about is how the reliance on top down maps (from the beginning) encourages dungeons that are relatively flat. You can have levels, but they are basically arranged like stories in a building. This is odd especially when it comes to something like caverns or the underdark, where you should have constant slopes, pits, connections, etc, but for ease of use it gets translated into something more more flat. I'm not sure isometric maps solve this problem, but they can help with something that is relatively small scale.

Or, consider something like level design in a videogame. One thing I love about dark souls is the complexity of the spaces. But it's a hard thing to translate to a functional dnd game.



View attachment 260416

I'll grant that a layout such as shown in the above map would be hard to depict top-down as there's so many elements directly beneath other elements. To do this top-down would require several maps (more on this below) plus a thumbnail overview like what is shown to indicate how everything connects together. Sometimes, a side-on view can also be useful. But even here, there's background elements blocked by foreground elements, particularly in the middle area.

In a setup like the one shown, what those several top-down maps would have to take care with (and IME many do not) are the following elements:
--- in every room there must be an elevation marker, showing the difference in elevation relative to a datum point (usually the entry room)
--- every connecting passage, stairway, etc. leaving one level must clearly show where it leads to on another level along with (and this is the bit most often overlooked) the linear distance it takes to get there! I can't count the number of times I've had maps that show a stairway or passage leaving one level and (on a different map) the same stairway arriving at another level but no indication anywhere of how long that stairway/passage is or how much vertical distance it covers. If even one of the maps shows the whole stairway/passage and its end, that's enough
--- sloping halls and rooms must be clearly marked as such, as must slopes and elevation changes within a rough chamber or cavern
--- stairs on any map must be, if anything, too clear about which direction goes up and which goes down. It's usually obvious enough for stairs between levels, but on the same level where a short flight of stairs connects two rooms or even two parts of a room, it's often impossible to tell whether those stairs lead up or down from which direction.

 

[Malmuria]

I'll grant that a layout such as shown in the above map would be hard to depict top-down as there's so many elements directly beneath other elements. To do this top-down would require several maps (more on this below) plus a thumbnail overview like what is shown to indicate how everything connects together. Sometimes, a side-on view can also be useful. But even here, there's background elements blocked by foreground elements, particularly in the middle area.

In a setup like the one shown, what those several top-down maps would have to take care with (and IME many do not) are the following elements:
--- in every room there must be an elevation marker, showing the difference in elevation relative to a datum point (usually the entry room)
--- every connecting passage, stairway, etc. leaving one level must clearly show where it leads to on another level along with (and this is the bit most often overlooked) the linear distance it takes to get there! I can't count the number of times I've had maps that show a stairway or passage leaving one level and (on a different map) the same stairway arriving at another level but no indication anywhere of how long that stairway/passage is or how much vertical distance it covers. If even one of the maps shows the whole stairway/passage and its end, that's enough
--- sloping halls and rooms must be clearly marked as such, as must slopes and elevation changes within a rough chamber or cavern
--- stairs on any map must be, if anything, too clear about which direction goes up and which goes down. It's usually obvious enough for stairs between levels, but on the same level where a short flight of stairs connects two rooms or even two parts of a room, it's often impossible to tell whether those stairs lead up or down from which direction.

I've been thinking something like this could be done with either shading or using different colors to indicate different elevations/levels. Though, you still have the problem of one level occluding what is on the level beneath