Martial power - what's with the unbreakable marks?

[Plane Sailing]

Looking through martial power I see a number of fighter powers which impose unbreakable marks on the target.

???

Surely this just reinstated the problem with a foe marked by both a paladin and a fighter who is damned by both opponents which the had to revise out of existence during the playtest?

 

[Victim]

Looking through martial power I see a number of fighter powers which impose unbreakable marks on the target.

???

Surely this just reinstated the problem with a foe marked by both a paladin and a fighter who is damned by both opponents which the had to revise out of existence during the playtest?

How so? If the mark is unbreakable, no one else will be able to mark the target after the initial mega-mark hits.

 

[Rafe]

Looking through martial power I see a number of fighter powers which impose unbreakable marks on the target.

???

Surely this just reinstated the problem with a foe marked by both a paladin and a fighter who is damned by both opponents which the had to revise out of existence during the playtest?

Can you type in the definition of an "unbreakable mark"? I don't have the book and it would be helpful for a reference.

 

[Foxman]

Looking through martial power I see a number of fighter powers which impose unbreakable marks on the target.

I only see two fighter powers that have lasting marks that cannot be superseeded. That means no one else can mark them. There are a few that mark a target until the end of the encounter but they say they can be superseeded...

Lasting Threat​

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Fighter Attack 1​

Following up your challenge with a solid attack, you force your
enemy to engage you.​

Daily​

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✦ Martial, Reliable, Weapon
Standard Action Melee weapon​

Target:​

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One creature​

Attack:​

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Strength vs. AC​

Hit:​

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3[W] + Strength modifier damage, and the target is
marked until the end of the encounter or until you are​

knocked unconscious. No mark can supersede this one.

OR

Carve Initials​

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Fighter Attack 15​

You cut deep and leave a meaningful mark.​

Daily​

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✦ Martial, Reliable, Weapon
Standard Action Melee weapon​

Requirement:​

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You must be wielding a light blade.​

Target:​

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One creature​

Attack:​

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Strength vs. AC​

Hit:​

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4[W] + Strength modifier damage, and the target is
marked until the end of the encounter or until you are​

knocked unconscious. No mark can supersede this one.

 

[Dan'L]

I don't think so. There can still only be one mark on a character at a time, so when a Fighter puts an "unbreakable" mark on an enemy, that just means that the Paladin can't divine challenge that creature, or a Swordmage use an Aegis ability against it, and that the fighter doesn't have to attack it every round for the mark to stay. Also, there are a few Rogue powers in Martial Power that would end the mark, so it isn't entirely unbreakable.

-Dan'L

 

[Doctor Proctor]

Yeah, the point of these powers is to act as an anti-BBEG power. Basically, you mark them for as long as you're conscious, and no one else can override it. This means that the BBEG will have to focus his attention on you, or risk CCII attacks. If he decides to ignore you anyway, he'll still have the -2 penalty to deal with.

These powers would be especially useful on enemies that are very mobile, like a Dragon. This allows you to make sure that when that Blue Dragon you're fighting takes off and flies 15 squares away to chomp on your Wizard that he'll be suffering a -2 penalty to hit. Even if it takes you 2 rounds to get there due to the distance, it doesn't matter because he's permanently marked now.

Of course, this might also mean that you become his sole target so that he can get rid of the mark...but then that means you're being a really good Defender. If you have some allies that can buff and heal you to keep you alive, you can really draw the attention away from the rest of your party. They're some of the ultimate "sticky" powers for a Fighter.

 

[CapnZapp]

In game terms, I understand the benefit of perma-marking a foe, so you can attend to other markers, and get the benefits even if that enemy flies away.

(I don't understand how to explain this in the game world - how can a Fighter have any bearing on what the Dragon does to your Wizard buddy if he can't reach the Dragon? - but I have also realized you're not supposed to care for verisimilitude if you want to play 4E)

However, the other benefit discussed, that the mark can't be superseded, I am less sure about?

If the fighter desperatedly wants to be the one who marks the BBEG, can't he just tell his Paladin chum to stay the frak out? (In other words, why use up a valuable power to do something simple communication can do better?)

Slightly confused,
Zapp

 

[Danceofmasks]

Maybe said fighter kicked the dragon in the nads while telling a yo momma joke.
I'd say that's a perma-mark ...

 

[Saeviomagy]

Paddlin' the school canoe?

Oh, you better believe that's a perma-mark.

 

[Benly]

However, the other benefit discussed, that the mark can't be superseded, I am less sure about?

This is not so much a benefit in its own right as it is a consequence of the benefit of an unbreakable mark: if you want to have a mark that never goes away, it has to prevent other marks onto that target to avoid the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation.