MM excerpt: phane

[StarFyre]

hmm

Kamikaze -- i find tons of creatures seem to have lost 'the cool' so just house rule them back

I've already got spreadsheets in the works for further and more pronounced changes to devils, demons, angels to make them truly how we envision them and have powers that we think they should have.

I can see myself modifying almost every monster above level 15 to some degree AND all dragons.

Sanjay

 

[maggot]

"Sorrowsworn soulrippers"? Arg! I don't think I could ever say that with a straight face.

Nounabuser Maggotposter

 

[mmu1]

I really don't buy this "the 3.5 version of the monster was too complex, so the only reasonable solution was to strip it down to the point where all it does is damage + a special effect" philosophy. Yes, high-level 3.5 play was too complex, but it's silly to say that this extreme level of oversimplification was the best possible solution.

When used as a level-appropriate encounter, a group of lowly 3.5 ghouls is probably more dangerous than this "epic" monster and its minions.

Not to mention that the fluff associated with this thing is just silly - it hits you, and you look old... for one whole round. "Oh, gods! I've been turned into a crippled old man! I have been laid low by the horr... Wait, I'm all better. Whew... Aw, damn, I'm all wrinkly and wizened again! And my armor doesn't fit right. And it's chafing in a really, really embarassing place... *sigh*"

I really can't imagine any encounter with this thing not turning completely laughable, with people cracking jokes about flipping back and forth between old and young... maybe that's just my group, but I don't think so.

 

[lukelightning]

I can't wait to fight one of these!

"I charge at the phane to chop it in half with my vorpal scimitar, what? He zaps me with some strange time ray? ...*zap*... the important thing to know is I was wearing an onion in my belt, as was the custom of the time.... get off my lawn!"

 

[Gargazon]

I can't wait to fight one of these!

"I charge at the phane to chop it in half with my vorpal scimitar, what? He zaps me with some strange time ray? ...*zap*... the important thing to know is I was wearing an onion in my belt, as was the custom of the time.... get off my lawn!"

Oh god, the old people jokes ... there will be many and they will be bad

That's it. This monster is IN.

 

[hong]

When used as a level-appropriate encounter, a group of lowly 3.5 ghouls is probably more dangerous than this "epic" monster and its minions.

What a silly comparison.

 

[WhatGravitas]

Kamikaze -- i find tons of creatures seem to have lost 'the cool' so just house rule them back

Fun thing about them: As they're not solo monsters, you can add weaker versions of the PCs as time duplicates. Even more fun: The phane gets a heap of flavour, if it isn't killed on 0 hp, but instead vanishes, just to re-appear later. If one stops to think that flavourful abilities have to be anchored in the statblock, it's easy to "script" fun scenes. 4E already focuses on more linked encounters - a second phane arriving mid-battle (representing a time-stream duplicate) is basically made for the system.

Cheers, LT.

 

[Lacyon]

Fun thing about them: As they're not solo monsters, you can add weaker versions of the PCs as time duplicates. Even more fun: The phane gets a heap of flavour, if it isn't killed on 0 hp, but instead vanishes, just to re-appear later. If one stops to think that flavourful abilities have to be anchored in the statblock, it's easy to "script" fun scenes. 4E already focuses on more linked encounters - a second phane arriving mid-battle (representing a time-stream duplicate) is basically made for the system.

Cheers, LT.

You, sir, are a farkin' genius.

 

[Carnivorous_Bean]

"Sorrowsworn soulrippers"? Arg! I don't think I could ever say that with a straight face.

Nounabuser Maggotposter

Agreed!

 

[Staffan]

Right, but every monster we've seen so far deals similarly small damage. I think it's more likely that damage output has just been significantly reduced in 4e compared to 3e.

It definitely has. Though I think the monsters doing lots of damage will primarily be the Brutes, and the only previews of those we've seen have been the RPG stats from the miniature game. Some monsters that are listed as level 7-9:

Angel of Valor (soldier 8): Longsword +16 vs AC, d8+3 AND Dagger +15 vs AC, d4+3.
Cleric of Pelor (controller (leader) 8): Mace +13 vs AC, d8+8.
Drow Spiderguard (soldier 8): Longsword +16 vs AC, d8+4
Howling Hag (controller 7): Wind Howl - Line 6, +10 vs Fort, d6+7 and Push 1
Bugbear Headreaver (brute 7): Greataxe - +12 vs AC, 2d10+4
Everfrost Ranger (skirmisher 9): Longbow - +13 vs AC, d8+9
Griffon (brute 7): Claw - +12 vs AC, 2d6+8; can make 2 claw attacks as a standard action

Of course, the critters have more abilities than it says here, usually limited powers that do more damage, but it seems clear that the big consistent damage dealers are brutes.