D&D 5E [Modified] Needing help with character progression/concept

[chaossdragon]

Greetings to all,

Long time haunter, short term poster. I recently joined a small group of friends and our endevor to learn 5e, granted we're all old pro's (term used loosly) of 3.5, so the transition and learning curve has been lessened slightly. However with the way multi-classing works, I realize that my concept will be tricky to say the least. So without further ado here is the thought process for my character and If you lovely people would be so kind to point out any flaws and glaring errors I may have made. (with the exception of DM ruled in my favor with will be noted)

**Original Build removed**

Half-Elf Warlock 2 (current status)
Abilities: STR 15 DEX 18 CON 16 INT 13 WIS 15 CHA 18
Archfey "Queen of Air and Darkness" Tome-lock / Background: Spy (homebrew used from dndwiki 5e backgrounds)
Skill Profs: Arcana(class), Deception(race), Insight(race), Investigation(class), Perception(background), Stealth(background) ... Picking up Persuasion with Bard 1
Spells: C Eldritch Blast, Minor Illusions 1 Armor of Agathys, Hex, Sleep
NOTES: Will be sticking to warlock till 4 for ASI (CHA) then pick up Bard till 6, 2 more Lock levels maxing out at 6, then back to Bard.
after first ASI, plan to pick up Resilence CON, and STR/CON +1 to round them off... will have 1 more ASI just not sure what to take.

Will talk to DM about downtime training to pick up prof with Rapiers (missed out on that with Lock lvl 1 instead of Bard)
Still keeping the manipulator/controller aspect of the original concept.

Also just seeking some feedback on a RP idea that I had. Initially setting up a couple random charts d4/d6/d8 for Eye color, Hair color, other tid bits of random disguise. Use this chart as much as possible to generate "personalities" and keep a running tab on the falsified identities I may use. Obviously one static 'Image' for the Bard whom should be fairly well known over time, but the rest for the 'spy' aspect.
Fits my Flaw of "I've worn so many disguises, I've lost sight of who I truly am."

Thanks in advance for any and all assistance in this endevor.

 

[Herobizkit]

Since you plan on multi-classing, keep in mind that ASI gains happen every four Class levels instead of every four combined class levels like in 3x (ie a Warlock 1/Monk 3 would not get as ASI until they advanced either their Warlock or Monk 'side' to level 4).

DISCLAIMER: I am not a powergaming/optimizing guru. I build for stuff/abilities I want regardless of whether or not it's optimal.

Depending on how patient you are, I'd consider:

Warlock 1
Warlock 2: get your invocations
W2/Monk 1: get your kung-fu and unarmored defense
W2/Monk 2: add on your ki and unarmored movement
W3/M2: become a Tomelock
W3/M3: become a Shadow Monk
W4/M3: get your first ASI
W4/M4: get your second ASI

Staggering this way gives you something to look forward to each level from each class rather than going through huge chunks of "one or the other". At least if your game burns out by level 8-10, you'll have gotten most of what you want.

If you're more focused on controls and subterfuge, I'd strongly consider becoming a LoreBard/Lok over a Monk/Lok. Bard is just too full of enchantment and divination goodies, and paired with Half-Elf, is just hella stronk in the people and skills department. Charisma does double-lifting, too.

 

[famousringo]

I think the key question is how you want to fight. One of the nice things about Warlocks is that they get everything they need to do good, reliable DPR at level 2, and it scales with character level so how you advance doesn't much matter after that.

If you're taking monk just for the mobility, utility, and some flavour, you can grab monk levels as you like. But if you really want to mix it up in melee (and I assume you do because you want Warcaster) rather than spamming Eldritch Blast all the time, you'll want to push monk hard and early for ki points, Extra Attack, and Stunning Fist.

 

[GrumpyGamer]

I would recommend 1-4 Warlock and pick up Shillelagh as a Cantrip using your tome ability. Do not take the Minor Illusion Cantrip, you will get that later as a Monk. You won't be much of a Monk, but you can role play being sort of like a monk using a Quaterstaff and Shillelagh. At level 4 pick up Resilience CON.

Levels 5-11 pick up Monk levels (You will eventually be 4 Warlock / 6 Monk). This will allow you to get access to Shadow Arts, the most useful being darkness and silence. It will also at level 11 get you access to Shadow Step. Pick up CHA +2 at level 8 (You will be 4th level Warlock and 4th level Monk at that point) .

The reason to pick up all of your Monk levels in one go is that Eldritch Blast is a Cantrip and scales with total level (not class level), so you are not losing too much to pick up those monk abilities.

From levels 12+ take more Warlock levels. I would likely not recommend War Caster, but by level 14 (next feat) you should have a pretty good idea if you want it. My guess is that instead of War Caster you may want to increase Wisdom to 18 to improve the save against your Monk Stun ability.

 

[chaossdragon]

Since you plan on multi-classing, keep in mind that ASI gains happen every four Class levels instead of every four combined class levels like in 3x (ie a Warlock 1/Monk 3 would not get as ASI until they advanced either their Warlock or Monk 'side' to level 4).

DISCLAIMER: I am not a powergaming/optimizing guru. I build for stuff/abilities I want regardless of whether or not it's optimal.

Depending on how patient you are, I'd consider:

Warlock 1
Warlock 2: get your invocations
W2/Monk 1: get your kung-fu and unarmored defense
W2/Monk 2: add on your ki and unarmored movement
W3/M2: become a Tomelock
W3/M3: become a Shadow Monk
W4/M3: get your first ASI
W4/M4: get your second ASI

Staggering this way gives you something to look forward to each level from each class rather than going through huge chunks of "one or the other". At least if your game burns out by level 8-10, you'll have gotten most of what you want.

If you're more focused on controls and subterfuge, I'd strongly consider becoming a LoreBard/Lok over a Monk/Lok. Bard is just too full of enchantment and divination goodies, and paired with Half-Elf, is just hella stronk in the people and skills department. Charisma does double-lifting, too.

reguarding your suggestion for LoreBard... how far would you recommend? personally after reading over it I think its a possibility as 6Lock/14Bard. Then again I'm not entirely sure where I want to go with the concept. I'm not overly concerned about my damage dealt, but more into the controlling of the battle, and letting others do the dirty work... guess I should have also mentioned in the original post. my alignment is N/E.

 

[Sezarious]

reguarding your suggestion for LoreBard... how far would you recommend? personally after reading over it I think its a possibility as 6Lock/14Bard. Then again I'm not entirely sure where I want to go with the concept. I'm not overly concerned about my damage dealt, but more into the controlling of the battle, and letting others do the dirty work... guess I should have also mentioned in the original post. my alignment is N/E.

Lore Bards are excellent in battlefield control. One of their best cantrips is Vicious Mockery (They make a Will save or take 1d4 damage and have disadvantage on their next attack).

Furthermore, lets say you just used vicious movkery on the minotaur that gored your friend, you then use healing word on your unconcious ally. Sure it heals less, but it's a verbal only, bonus action, 30ft range healing spell. So you just revived someone AND messed with the enemies next attack!

What's nastier still about lore bards, say the minotaur looks like it may just pass its save for vicious mockery, but you REALLY want to make it fail, use your reaction, roll a d8 and subtract that from its save! Do the same thing for your allies when they cast spells and furthermore, you get to do this Cha mod/long rest, then /short rest at 6th.

Want to help the party fighter in a grapple? Cutting words! Taunt your enemy! Make them feel insecure!

Want to help make an enemy follow your suggestion spell? Cutting words!

I will post a suggested tweak soon.... There are a couple of niggling issues I see.

 

[Sezarious]

Half Elf Warlock - Lv1
Stats: Str 15 Dex 18 Con 16 Int 13 Wis 15 Cha 18 - Swap Int and Str, and Wis with Con. Int means very little in 5e compared to previous editions unless it is class specific. Furthermore, in optimising a Charisma build, you want to prorotise Charisma, Dex, the Con.

At Warlock level 2, you take the 'Many faces' Invocation and a throwaway second invocation you will need at lv 3.

Warlock 3: If I were you, I'd go pact of the tome and swap your throwaway invocation for the tomelock ritual invocation. Take guidance shillaeghleigh and maybe resistance from the druid cantrips. Guidance is another little battlefield control spell, but shillaeghleigh is awesome, because it's a magic weapon that will use your Cha mod for damage! Take the find familiar spell from the ritual invocation and use an Owl. Owls have the flyby ability, meaning they don't provoke Attacks of opportunity. They can fly at an enemy, use the help action granting one of your party advantage and then fly back to safety. Chain familiars aren't that much better than normal ones when you use rhem in this way.

Furthermore, to go with the spy concept, with the pact of the tome, you can eventually steal a wizards "phantom steed" ritual, so that you can periodically summon a ghostly looking 100ft speed mount without the need of a spell slot!

Go to Warlock 4, when you should take the following ASI.
ASI: CHA +2

This means more eventual bardic inspiration, harder spell save dcs and max damage with your melee weapon.

Then 6 levels in lore bard will get you access to awesome spells like haste! Or paladin auras! Or maybe find steed. Maybe you'll then create a glyph of warding with the find steed spell and let another party member activate it. They'll be like.... Whoah! Intelligent celestial horse? Where did that come from?

Best of all, most of yourabilities will refresh every short rest!

Excuse me... Must sleep now.

 

[GrumpyGamer]

Lore bards do make great characters and I really like how they could work with your idea of infiltrator. One point of clarification though:

What's nastier still about lore bards, say the minotaur looks like it may just pass its save for vicious mockery, but you REALLY want to make it fail, use your reaction, roll a d8 and subtract that from its save! Do the same thing for your allies when they cast spells and furthermore, you get to do this Cha mod/long rest, then /short rest at 6th.

You can use your bardic dice to cause the enemy to fail an ability check, but not a save. These are two different sets of rolls.

 

[Sezarious]

Oh wow. Whoops..... I may have been playing them incorrectly then.... But then, others have also failed to make said distinction. I assume it's a common mistake?

 

[chaossdragon]

Half Elf Warlock - Lv1
Stats: Str 15 Dex 18 Con 16 Int 13 Wis 15 Cha 18 - Swap Int and Str, and Wis with Con. Int means very little in 5e compared to previous editions unless it is class specific. Furthermore, in optimising a Charisma build, you want to prorotise Charisma, Dex, the Con.

If I can I will but we are two sessions in so I doubt the DM will allow me to modify my character... He might but I am not holding my breath... So with that said Stats listed are as is. (for now)

We just hit level two and personally leaning heavily towards Warlock 2... Unless I can convince the DM to allow me to uhm 'edit' my char to be Bard Lvl 1, then pick up the Lock... otherwise staying Lock till 4 for ASI then Bard 6, Lock 5-6 (unless someone can change my mind here...) then backto Bard till 20. (If we make it that far)

Also most Bard/Lock MC's I've read up on seem to favor 17/3, where I am leaning towards 14/6 Knowing that Bard's get the Magical Secrets : 2 at 10, 2 at 14, 2 at 18. While having access to rituals (up to half warlock level rounded up via Tome Pact) so... Find Familiar, ??? not sure what to take as 2nd ritual.