More Dark SUn tidbits by Rich Baker

[Rechan]

I would personally be shocked if the Dark Sun book said 'Yeah, these classes DO NOT EXIST in Athas'.

I doubt they're going to ban power sources in the books. They may not MENTION them, or say they are rare, but not flat out say "Yeah there's none here".

Similar to how I think they won't say "There's no beholders/illithids/whatnot" in Athas. They will simply not mention them.

Because "An official list of things that don't belong in this setting" is really not what I want from WotC, among other things.

Besides, that's not what "Everything is core" means. "Everything is core" means that you can pick up Dark Sun Player's Guide, and take the rules and put them in your game, and things arne't broken. In fact, you're encouraged.

 

[SSquirrel]

See I think it would be far more interesting to say that there are no gods, but we still see classes with the divine power source functioning. Maybe they are worshiping the earth itself or elements like the original version. What if the Primordials killed off the gods and usurped their place. People may still believe fervently in the old gods, but those prayers are being intercepted and answered by powerful Primordials.

 

[Wik]

See I think it would be far more interesting to say that there are no gods, but we still see classes with the divine power source functioning. Maybe they are worshiping the earth itself or elements like the original version. What if the Primordials killed off the gods and usurped their place. People may still believe fervently in the old gods, but those prayers are being intercepted and answered by powerful Primordials.

The problem with this is radiant damage. It's too "holy water" esque. Too goody two-shoes. And it displaces the power of the elements that is core to the Athasian theme.

 

[Mouseferatu]

The problem with this is radiant damage. It's too "holy water" esque. Too goody two-shoes. And it displaces the power of the elements that is core to the Athasian theme.

There's nothing inherently "goody" about radiant damage. In fact, I'd argue that radiant damage has a strong place in Athas: many powers having to do with the sun.

 

[Kobold Avenger]

The problem with this is radiant damage. It's too "holy water" esque. Too goody two-shoes. And it displaces the power of the elements that is core to the Athasian theme.

Warlock powers especially those of the Starlock do radiant damage. I'd hardly call them "goody-two-shoes" getting powers from alien entities and eldritch abominations that will drive you insane and consume the world.

Of course now that really does make me wonder what an Athasian Warlock is like...

 

[Rechan]

In the show "Supernatural", a psychic was trying to see the true form of an angel (at the time, they thought it was a demon or other entity). Her eyes were burned out of her skull at the glimpse.

That's what I would consider radiant damage. It's not "Good", it's "Here is RAW OTHERWORLDLY POWER unaffiliated with an element".

 

[MaximumHavoc]

In the show "Supernatural", a psychic was trying to see the true form of an angel (at the time, they thought it was a demon or other entity). Her eyes were burned out of her skull at the glimpse.

That's what I would consider radiant damage. It's not "Good", it's "Here is RAW OTHERWORLDLY POWER unaffiliated with an element".

the bold is why i think the easy fix is to say that all radiant damage instead is fire damage.

now, parallelism would suggest that necrotic damage instead is cold damage, but this raises a few issues. necrotic energy is most closely associated with the shadowfell, the natural world's dimmer echo, but radiant energy is most closely associated with the astral sea--the plane of the gods--not the feywild, which is the natural world's more vibrant echo. so, necrotic energy seems not to be completely parallel to radiant energy and therefore need not necessarily mimic radiant's dark sun modification (as i am depicting it). on the other hand, as i understand it, athas does not really have connections to ANY planes, with the possible exception of (what is now) the elemental chaos, so, in that respect, perhaps necrotic should be treated similarly to radiant.

on a slightly separate note, perhaps all divine classes could instead worship, or derive their power from, primordials.

 

[Rechan]

necrotic energy is most closely associated with the shadowfell, the natural world's dimmer echo

In all honesty I never really associated Necrotic with the shadowfell. While things from the shadowfell likely use necrotic more frequently than something from say, the Feywild, I wouldn't associate the two.

Necrotic to me is decay. It's concentrated entropy. The Shadowfell isn't necessarily entropic in nature.

 

[JohnSnow]

I would personally be shocked if the Dark Sun book said 'Yeah, these classes DO NOT EXIST in Athas'.

I doubt they're going to ban power sources in the books. They may not MENTION them, or say they are rare, but not flat out say "Yeah there's none here".

Similar to how I think they won't say "There's no beholders/illithids/whatnot" in Athas. They will simply not mention them.

Maybe. But that's certainly not the impression that Rodney Thompson is giving. From his blog on the Wizards Community...

Athas is a desolate place where survival is not assured, where the very land can kill you, and where even the points of light (to use a 4E-favorite term) are ruled by darkness. It's a world of sword-and-sandal adventuring, of low tech and dangerous magic. It's a world where psionics is common, and where there are no gods to pray to or receive power from. It's a world where the land is struggling to stay alive, and its defenders face a near-hopeless task to keep it that way. Dark Sun is a dangerous world, a world of survival of the fittest, but...it's also a world for heroes. They might not think of themselves as such, but Athas is a place where evil rules so long as the common man does nothing.
...
It's not a kitchen sink setting by any means; there are things that are part of other settings which simply won't be seen in the Dark Sun setting.

Emphasis mine.

I dunno about you, but that seems pretty clear to me. In his previous blog, he talked about how easy it was to remove the divine power source ENTIRELY when running a Dark Sun adventure at GwenCon.

Take that as you will.

 

[Rechan]

Emphasis mine.

And in Eberron, there's no proof the gods Exist, despite the power that you get from them.

I am willing to bet money that there is no list of "These classes/power sources don't belong in Athas" in the book. Options will be there to allow clerics, paladins, avengers et all to function.

Especially given that all the Primal classes are in PHB 2. THat's not very encouraging to say "Yeah the classes you need for healers? In another book you have to buy".

I dunno about you, but that seems pretty clear to me. In his previous blog, he talked about how easy it was to remove the divine power source ENTIRELY when running a Dark Sun adventure at GwenCon.

Which is like Mearls giving instructions on how to give typed bonuses at levels instead of using magical items, and saying "This is proof they're getting rid of magical items".