Multi-armed Monks

[Arcturus_Rugend]

How do multi-armed monks work? For example, if a monk had the insectile template from SS, it would have a total of six arms. Now the tough part...

1) How many natural weapons is he considered to have?
2) How do feats such as Multidexterity, Multiattack, and Multi-weapon Fighting work with this character?

Multidexterity says the creature would ignore penalties for using an off hand, but an unarmed monk (at least one with ony TWO arms) isn't considered to HAVE an off hand.

Multiattack has a requirement of having three or more natural weapons, but how many is the monk considered to have, and which of his "weapons" would be considered secondary?

Multi-weapon fighting says the penalties for fighting with multiple weapons are reduced by 2, but is its unclear if they mean melee weapons or if this can apply to natural weapons, and (AGAIN), how many "weapons" the monk actually has.

 

[Arcturus_Rugend]

(cups hand to ear)

***the chirping of crickets***

Hello? Anyone there?

 

[Crothian]

The rules do not cover this area. The monk class is assumed to be for the basic two armed humaniod. And the book that should have addressed this, Savage Species, doesn't.

 

[Arcturus_Rugend]

Hmmm.

That's not the answer I was hoping for.

That seems to be a major oversight on the part of the designers and WOTC.

 

[Crothian]

I know it is not what you were looking for, but if it is covered somewhere, I cannot find it.

Now, if you my advice, I'd either create a single feat that would allow a 3 or more armed monk to use more arms and thus have an improved version of flurry of blows. Or I'd just keep the monk as it is and the creature would not get any more attacks based on more arms.

 

[Gargoyle]

I agree that there seem to be no official guidelines. Here's how I understand it though.

First look at the multi-armed monk without the feats. He uses the rules for the monk class:

1. His whole body is one natural weapon. Monks can head butt, attack with elbows, kick, etc, so having extra arms doesn't help, just like having your arms cut off wouldn't stop you from making unarmed strikes.

2. He would use flurry of blows to gain a single extra attack with unarmed strikes or monk weapons, instead of the rules for two-weapon fighting. In this case, the extra arms just allow him to carry more things.

Then with the feats, he has the option of using the two weapon fighting rules:

1. With Multiattack he has a number of natural weapons equal to the number of arms, and follows the rules in that feat description for multiple unarmed strikes.

2. With Multidexterity and Multi-weapon Fighting, he can use those rules to attack with each weapon held, like a marileth demon.

Note that you can't use a flurry of blows and two-weapon fighting at the same time to gain even more attacks. The full attack action can do either for a multi-limbed monk, not both. The monk with these feats must choose which rules system to use each round.

 

[Arcturus_Rugend]

Thanks, guys. I appreciate the input. I think you've given me enough to piece together a fairly workable solution until they come up with an official fix or clarification.

I sure hope that 3.5 clears up some of this.

 

[Nareau]

having extra arms doesn't help, just like having your arms cut off wouldn't stop you from making unarmed strikes.

Seems to me that if your arms were cut off, you could ONLY make "unarmed strikes"!

Yuk yuk yuk...

 

[Ruethagr]

Firstly do note that unarmed and natural attacks are considered completely separate.

You would have the same number of natural attacks as a normal non-insectile creature of your race. So zero for anything other than the monster races.

The monk is considered to have an off hand attack option though no particular part of the monk's body is considered an off hand with regards to unarmed attacks. This allows the monk to make one additional attack at a -5 per full attack option, however generally using fury of blows is a wiser choice. There is no feat in my knowledge that lowers this penalty. It is entirely up to your GM as there are no rules I can find for it, but you may be given 5 rather than just 1 off hand attacks in this way to account for your 6 arms. But again, that is your Game Master's choice.

Natural weaponry is more powerful than unarmed attacks because your primary natural attack(claw, bite, wing, tail etc.) is used at your full base attack no matter how many of that primary attack you have. For example: a dire humanoid gets 1 bite attack and 2 claw attacks. The claw attacks are his primary so he makes both attacks at his highest base attack bonus, the bite is secondary so it gets a -5 unless he has multiattack to reduce it. Any other natural attacks that he may have from his base race are also considered secondary and receive the same penalty.

Multiweapon fighting is intended for weapons only, not natural attacks and not unarmed attacks.

There are several feats and abilities that would allow you to utilize the arms given.

The Still Weapon Style feat allows you to choose one melee weapon type(Claws, Longsword, Spear) to be considered unarmed with for the purposes of feats and abilities. Many GMs will ban its use because it is easily exploited.

The Temple Swordsman is a background quality and not an actual feat that allows you full proficiency in one type of weapon. With this weapon you can use your unarmed attack bonus and fury of blows, the price is that you can never gain proficiency in any other type of weapon.

There are several feats that give you claw attacks, though many of the specify only two, they are generally intended for two armed beings and your GM may allow it to be per arm. If not, then you could combine them. The quickest and easiest to apply is Tooth and Nail, as a medium creature you get 2 claw and one bite attacks at 1d4 damage each. The prerequisite is that you have a form able to have claws which an insectile creature does.

But honestly speaking, there are too few guidelines for many-armed unarmed fighters. Within the bounds of the books I have access to, you would be far better off using multiple weapons as opposed to trying to utilize unarmed with six limbs.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

They exist, see this link: D&D Fight Club

Kitzukhan can make unarmed attacks with all of his hands, but cannot make multiple attacks with any of them.

Example attacks:

4 claws +21 melee [+5 thri-kreen, +8 monk, +6{8} Str (belt)] (1d12+8) plus bite +19 [+3 thri-kreen, +8 monk, +6{8} Str (belt)] 1d4 + poison

OR
gythka +19/+19/+14 [+3 thri-kreen, +8/+8/+3 monk, +6{8} Str (belt)] (1d8+8 [crit x3])

Thri-kreen (6 HD, monstrous humanoid so BAB = +6) and Monk 11 (BAB +8 or so). This is 3.0 though.

I once saw a similar character; apparently, he could make as many attacks as a monk of his level, plus 1 additional attack per additional limb! I don't know if that was official though.