D&D 5E Multiclassing speculation

[Olgar Shiverstone]

So, with multiclassing only teased until the PHB, what do we think the limitations will be?

Stat prerequisite -- 13 or 15?

First level benefits -- what do we think you don't gain?

 

[Prism]

Well if we use the playtest as a guide is generally 15 for most classes or 13 in two stats for a few.I think they might stick with those.

To make it fair I guess they need to grant most proficiencies else it would always make sense if you could to start with the class with most proficiencies and then multi class into the other. Unless of course they reduce class features instead

So a fighter/wizard might start wizard with fewer spells known and a wizard/fighter might not be able to use heavy armour. That could get overly complicated though so I reckon you'll get most the starting stuff

 

[Li Shenron]

First level benefits -- what do we think you don't gain?

My guess: you just won't gain the skills* and saving throw proficiencies of additional classes. You will gain tools, weapons and armor proficiencies instead.

*unless the new class grants more than the first, in which case you get as many new skills as the difference

Examples:

A Fighter takes a level of Wizard: no new profs.

A Wizard takes a level of Fighter: gain all weapons and armors profs.

A Fighter takes a level of Rogue: gain 2 more skills and Thieves' Tools profs.


Basically, with these rules, all PCs (single- or multi-classe) always have 2 ST proficiencies, and always either 4 skills prof, or 6 skills prof in case one of their classes is Rogue, Bard or Ranger.

 

[Agamon]

My guess: you just won't gain the skills* and saving throw proficiencies of additional classes. You will gain tools, weapons and armor proficiencies instead.

Crossing my fingers that this is the case. The skill and save profs are what bug me about the playtest multiclass.

 

[tuxgeo]

IMHO, the largest change between the playtest multiclassing rules and the Basic multiclassing rules is the need to meet the ability score requirements for both the former class and the new class. This is huge. It might also put a strain on people's abilities, in both senses: with a 27-point-buy rather than a 30-point-buy, it will be harder for PCs to have scores of 15+ in two different abilities, and that will limit their players' abilities to multiclass.

For that reason, WotC might have cut down the requirements: instead of 15+ (or 13+ to two stats), the PHB requirement might be 14+ instead. We'll see.

The Basic PDF file clearly states, "When you gain a level in a class other than your first, you gain only some of that class's starting proficiencies."
What makes the most sense? A new Wizard would need to know Arcana; a new Fighter would need at least Medium Armor and Shields, maybe a couple of weapons (but not the entire weapon list).

I'm thinking the multiclasser might be viable with 1 new Skill, 0 new Saves, all new Tools, 2 new Armors, and 2 new Weapons. I doubt that will turn out to be the actual rule, but it makes sense to me.

 

[1of3]

For that reason, WotC might have cut down the requirements: instead of 15+ (or 13+ to two stats), the PHB requirement might be 14+ instead. We'll see.

I think they will stick with odd stats. They use odd stats for prerequisites because they have no other use for them. That has been the way since 3e.

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

I'm personally hoping the stat prerequisite is 15+. With the default array and racial adjustments, it's easy for a character to have two 15+ scores early, and supports two-class multiclassing. With 13+, you're looking at potentially four scores in that range, which I think would encourage too much "level dipping".

 

[Li Shenron]

IMHO, the largest change between the playtest multiclassing rules and the Basic multiclassing rules is the need to meet the ability score requirements for both the former class and the new class. This is huge. It might also put a strain on people's abilities, in both senses: with a 27-point-buy rather than a 30-point-buy, it will be harder for PCs to have scores of 15+ in two different abilities, and that will limit their players' abilities to multiclass.

For that reason, WotC might have cut down the requirements: instead of 15+ (or 13+ to two stats), the PHB requirement might be 14+ instead. We'll see.

The Basic PDF file clearly states, "When you gain a level in a class other than your first, you gain only some of that class's starting proficiencies."
What makes the most sense? A new Wizard would need to know Arcana; a new Fighter would need at least Medium Armor and Shields, maybe a couple of weapons (but not the entire weapon list).

I'm thinking the multiclasser might be viable with 1 new Skill, 0 new Saves, all new Tools, 2 new Armors, and 2 new Weapons. I doubt that will turn out to be the actual rule, but it makes sense to me.

Good points, it might also be 1 additional proficiencies.

But don't pick something like Wizard's Arcana or Cleric's Religion as a basis for reasoning... First of all, while these are obvious choices, notice that no Wizard has to take Arcana proficiency and no Cleric has to take Religion. They are iconic choices, but if you think about it, they don't necessarily need them. A Wizard without Arcana is not crippled in any way, she just has a lower chance of answering questions related to magic, but she still knows the same amount of spells and casts them at the same power as any other Wizard. So the game doesn't have to grant 1 more skill to a Fighter turned Wizard just because of this... only to maybe see that player get away with another choice!

If you take the Fighter or the Rogue as a basis instead, you'll notice that none of their skill is as iconic as Arcana for Wizards or Religion for Clerics. Rogues' skills altogether are iconic (in fact I'm positive that when you multiclass into Rogue you'll get 2 more skills), but not a single one is so essential that someone shouldn't be a Rogue without it. Fighter skills even less so.

About score requirements, we have to see what are the numbers. If they are too low (13 or less), then IMHO they should have scrapped them altogether. If they are significant (15 or more) then this is actually a system for preventing heavy multiclassing.

 

[Kobold Stew]

What makes the most sense? A new Wizard would need to know Arcana; a new Fighter would need at least Medium Armor and Shields, maybe a couple of weapons (but not the entire weapon list).

I'm thinking the multiclasser might be viable with 1 new Skill, 0 new Saves, all new Tools, 2 new Armors, and 2 new Weapons. I doubt that will turn out to be the actual rule, but it makes sense to me.

I'm with Li Shenron on this: it makes perfect sense to me that someone multi classing into Cleric or Wizard would *not* have the skill proficiencies in those areas.

Based on what we've seen, what you get from multi classing is clear for the most part -- the only uncertainty falls under "proficiencies".

I could see granting weapons and armour and tools.

It's only saves and extra skills that are uncertain. My instinct would be that players should choose one save and x-1 skills, but I suspect they will have something more elegant than that.

 

[drjones]

I am guessing 15+ as well, with level based stat increases it will still be possible to sacrifice being great at one thing for being good at a bunch of things. Without that sacrifice it would be a 'no brainier' for some playstyles to always dip. Also since the stats can't be bumped past 20 with level upgrades even a hardcore specialist will have some points they can afford to use elsewhere.