D&D General (+) Mundane fixes to the caster martial divide

[Oofta]

Should a mundane person be capable of overcoming supernatural problems?

And if yes, how?

If no, how should the game be changed to better reflect/reinforce that?

Define "supernatural problems". I don't want the fighter to be a wizard with a different label and if that means that the fighter can't do a few things as well as the wizard I'm okay with that.

 

[bert1001 fka bert1000]

If you want your fixes to the martial caster divide to be entirely mundane, then this is the thread for you! If it's not, message me and I'll help create a solution that's right for you!

While I know @Lanefan may want it that way, I bet there are plenty of others out there that would also enjoy this.

First off, I think the Dungeon Crawl Classics would satisfy that requirement. Let's link to that.

Dungeon Crawl Classics RPG|Goodman Games

goodman-games.com

Also, removing many high level spells and replacing them with 4E style rituals would also greatly curtail runaway caster power. I'll link to some 4E thing.

4th Edition

The 4th edition of the Dungeons & Dragons roleplaying game comprises an intercompatible set of rulebooks and other products published by Wizards of the Coast from 2007 through 2013. Wizards of the Coast acquired the license for Dungeons & Dragons since 1997 during its 2nd edition, and they had...

dnd4.fandom.com

That's a start. How else can we fix this without going over the top with our Fighters???

I like the concept of what you are doing here, but I suggest you edit all your OPs to be very very explicit about all the assumptions you want the conversation to be bound by. Otherwise you are going to have the same kind of cross contamination as the other threads.

For example, really spellcasters need to be nerfed first! So if we only let spellcasters have up to 5th level spells then my mundane martial looks like this... etc.

My suggestions for this thread:

Assume:

• spellcasters remain exactly as is
• mundane = no further than typical action heroes
• we are creating a new class. The Fighter will still be an option as is (so that this objection is removed)
• class attached magic items are off the table

others?

 

[Tony Vargas]

Should a mundane person be capable of overcoming supernatural problems?

And if yes, how?

Yes.

Look to RL superstitions. Toss a handful of corn on the ground, the superntural monster stops to count the grains. Pour salt across the threshold of the room's entrances, incorporeal creatures won't be able to enter (not even through the walls or cieling, magic is about symbolism and intent). Keep a sprig of fresh rue in your pocket and basilisks can't hurt you. Anyone with a Holy Symbol can turn undead like a Cleric of their level. Hit a werewolf with a broom (the bristly end) and it will be forced back to its human form. A circle of iron filings will keep demons and ghouls at bay. Wear your True Love's favor and no charm or enchantment can touch you.
Then make up some more... Invoke the name of Pelor and any devil before you shall be banished. Intellect Devourers hate coarse food, eat rye bread every day and they won't touch you. Wear a wreath of fresh daisies and monsters with darkvision can't see you.

 

[MichaelSomething]

I like the concept of what you are doing here, but I suggest you edit all your OPs to be very very explicit about all the assumptions you want the conversation to be bound by. Otherwise you are going to have the same kind of cross contamination as the other threads.

Where's the natural language fan club when you need'em?

 

[Tony Vargas]

Where's the natural language fan club when you need'em?

 

[bloodtide]

Should a mundane person be capable of overcoming supernatural problems?

And if yes, how?

If no, how should the game be changed to better reflect/reinforce that?

Yes.

The basic idea of at least half of all Conan fiction is how he fights the supernatural with the mundane. And evil sorcerer summons a demon beast from the outer darkness.....and Conan grabs the nearest sword saying "Taste cold steel demon!" and hacks off the head of the demon beast. And even the times when the demon beast is all "hahah, mortal weapons can not harm me", Conan can STILL crush it in a cave in, drop a stalactite on it or light it on fire.

For a more modern example is, of course: Supernatural. Mundane hunters fighting the supernatural.

 

[Scribe]

Yes.

Look to RL superstitions. Toss a handful of corn on the ground, the superntural monster stops to count the grains. Pour salt across the threshold of the room's entrances, incorporeal creatures won't be able to enter (not even through the walls or cieling, magic is about symbolism and intent). Keep a sprig of fresh rue in your pocket and basilisks can't hurt you. Anyone with a Holy Symbol can turn undead like a Cleric of their level. Hit a werewolf with a broom (the bristly end) and it will be forced back to its human form. A circle of iron filings will keep demons and ghouls at bay. Wear your True Love's favor and no charm or enchantment can touch you.
Then make up some more... Invoke the name of Pelor and any devil before you shall be banished. Intellect Devourers hate coarse food, eat rye bread every day and they won't touch you. Wear a wreath of fresh daisies and monsters with darkvision can't see you.

Is this the mundane overcoming the supernatural, or is it the function of the supernatural?

Is a 'melee attack' really just a cantrip spell with no VS component (the M being the item held in the hand striking the target) at melee range?

 

[Micah Sweet]

Shocking grasp or inflict wounds. I'm 100% okay with cure wounds provoking, because that's why healing word exists.

I hate Healing Word. It's the poster child for 5e Whack-a-Mole.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Yes.

Look to RL superstitions. Toss a handful of corn on the ground, the superntural monster stops to count the grains. Pour salt across the threshold of the room's entrances, incorporeal creatures won't be able to enter (not even through the walls or cieling, magic is about symbolism and intent). Keep a sprig of fresh rue in your pocket and basilisks can't hurt you. Anyone with a Holy Symbol can turn undead like a Cleric of their level. Hit a werewolf with a broom (the bristly end) and it will be forced back to its human form. A circle of iron filings will keep demons and ghouls at bay. Wear your True Love's favor and no charm or enchantment can touch you.
Then make up some more... Invoke the name of Pelor and any devil before you shall be banished. Intellect Devourers hate coarse food, eat rye bread every day and they won't touch you. Wear a wreath of fresh daisies and monsters with darkvision can't see you.

We need a lot more of this!

 

[Tony Vargas]

Is this the mundane overcoming the supernatural, or is it the function of the supernatural?

That's the mundane way of doing things, it's always a function of the thing being done to. You build a boat out of wood, because wood floats. You put out a fire with water, because of the nature of fire.

So, yeah, the mundane way of dealing with the supernatural is to use its nature (or other supernaturals) against it.

Is a 'melee attack' really just a cantrip spell with no VS component (the M being the item held in the hand striking the target) at melee range?

That is a decidedly Mage the Ascension question