D&D 5E My tweak to make (Champion) Fighters decent

[GlassJaw]

Fighters need something cool to do out of combat. They are effective in combat, and Champion is certainly boring though.


Sent from my iPhone using EN World

 

[ccs]

Maybe in a Feats game they are more balanced though I doubt it, having played 3 levels of a Fighter with feats alongside a barbarian in Out of the Abyss. The lack of reckless attack option really hurts Fighter, as does
their squishiness.

You know, I've heard fighters called alot of things over the years, but your the 1st to proclaim them as squishy.

 

[S'mon]

You know, I've heard fighters called alot of things over the years, but your the 1st to proclaim them as squishy.

Amy class without spell defences who can't half damage is squishy in 5e. Rogues half damage as a reaction. Barbs just resist. Casters have protective spells. Fighter is SOL.

 

[ccs]

Fighters need something cool to do out of combat. They are effective in combat, and Champion is certainly boring though.


Sent from my iPhone using EN World

This is a DM & player based problem, not a class design flaw.

 

[Eubani]

This is a DM & player based problem, not a class design flaw.

Not true, Fighters sacrifice gaining abilities in exploring and social so that they can be "the best" at fighting, which they are behind till about 11th and then only catch up or pull ahead a very small amount. A few minor exploration or social abilities would not hurt at all.

 

[S'mon]

Why not allow the two bonus ASIs the fighter gets to access a limited selection of feats? Sentinel and shields master spring to mind as massively improving fighter utility by improving his action economy and HAM greatly improves durability.

It's an online game, one Fighter player is my 9 year old son, the other Fighter player is in a different country and doesn't own a PHB. So no Feats for him. I could let my son take Feats but it would create a disparity with the no-Feat PCs, prob I'd have to let everyone take Feats, combat would slow to a crawl, the campaign would fail.

 

[Gladius Legis]

Not true, Fighters sacrifice gaining abilities in exploring and social so that they can be "the best" at fighting, which they are behind till about 11th and then only catch up or pull ahead a very small amount.

I can't agree with this. I'll give you the Champion and the PDK, but the other archetypes are doing just fine before Lv. 11. The Battlemaster is changing misses into hits (Precision Attack) and getting reaction attacks in melee (Riposte) since Lv. 3. The Eldritch Knight is getting advantage more often than not with their familiar since Lv. 3, and then War Magic with Booming Blade and/or Green-Flame Blade at Lv. 7 is better in many cases than 3 attacks/round.

 

[TallIan]

It's an online game, one Fighter player is my 9 year old son, the other Fighter player is in a different country and doesn't own a PHB. So no Feats for him. I could let my son take Feats but it would create a disparity with the no-Feat PCs, prob I'd have to let everyone take Feats, combat would slow to a crawl, the campaign would fail.

Ok that sounds complicated, I was thinking more along the lines of a small selection.

The biggest issue I have with fighters are the very limited use of bonus action especially and reaction. Many other classes have options that they can use most rounds for wither of those. That's why I really like feats like sentinel, pole-arm master and shield master.

 

[hejtmane]

Amy class without spell defences who can't half damage is squishy in 5e. Rogues half damage as a reaction. Barbs just resist. Casters have protective spells. Fighter is SOL.

I find EK that focus on shield and absorb elements to be very tankie it changes a lot of the dynamics; I love the Battle Master for DPS and versatility, but EK gives you the survival edge on par with the other classes and a DPS boost 3&4 and 7-10 levels (SCAG Cantrips)

I think the issue is that fighters in a no feat game can feel behind until the third attack come into play at 11

 

[S'mon]

BTW we're only using the Champion Fighter. The idea is to have viable simple PCs in a no-feats, theatre of the mind, online text-chat game.

I give Champions the Remarkable Athlete bonus on all STR/DEX/CON checks so they are ok out of combat, not quite as good as raging Barb's advtg on STR checks and totem Barb's wide variety of useful powers.