Neat Little Gamist Rulesy Things

[sinecure]

Fast Poisons - Work as written.
Slow Poisons - Work like a disease but make checks after every short rest (as well as extended rests).

Bluntly, you make a check more or less everytime your heart rate spikes.

Thank you man. I was gonna say. Who has to wait for rules to be made for them?

You have been Poisoned: Save vs. DC or die.

 

[Jer]

What gamist bits about 4E really turn your crank? Which ones bug you to no end? Are there any elements that looked good/bad on paper but in play turned out to be bad/good?

Healing surges - I wasn't sure about them on paper, but in practice they rock. I especially like how the clerical/paladin healing concepts have been wrapped up into the healing surge mechanics. Sure it's a bit gamist, but it works nicely.

Minions. I always like "minions" in my games. I want to see how they work at higher levels because, frankly, 1st level minions aren't the best way to measure a minion mechanic.

Marks. Like mattdm, I wasn't sure these were going to work at all. Fiddly penalties to keep track of? How is this making things simpler at the table? In practice, though, both the paladin and the fighter in my first game figured out how to use these suckers well AND they kept me "honest" about which targets were marked in play. I'm a bit worried about when I'm using monsters that have the ability to mark a target, but we'll see when we get there.

I'm still not sold on the utility of milestones, though. Maybe it's because my group never completes more than two combat encounters in a single session anyway, but I'm just not sure of what they're supposed to be doing for the game. Maybe once we've played a bit more I'll get a better feel for their usefulness, but right now it just feels like "one more thing to keep track of" at the end of the night...

 

[Teydyn]

You have been Poisoned: Save vs. DC or die.

You dont save vs DC.

The Poison "attacks" your Defenses and you Save vs 10 (barring rare modifiers)

 

[Mercule]

Currently (and without having played 4e yet), it's the core mechanical change: You roll for attacks, not for defence. That (seems) cool, elegant, and action-provoking.

This has received universal praise from my group, even those who aren't otherwise thrilled with 4e.

The new coin-flip saves, though... not so much.

 

[Argyuile]

I love minions, the thing I love most about minions is that they make running low level Spelljammer a distinct possibility. You can actually have ship to ship combat and boarding actions with full crews /drool.

 

[Cadfan]

Nonstacking.

Lets say that Trip in 3e is a station wagon. In 3e, you own this station wagon, and perhaps you want to improve it. So you spend a feat to get rims. Then you spend a feat to get hydraulics. Then you spend a feat to get neon lights. Every feat you spend upgrades the same station wagon. When the core rules come out, maybe the only thing you can get for your station wagon are rims, and the game is balanced on this assumption, but eventually the designers create all kinds of things for your station wagon, and you end up with a massively pimped out ride that isn't appropriate for the power curve that you saw in the core rules.

In 4e, something like Trip isn't a station wagon. Its like a brand of station wagons. If you want the station wagon with the sweet rims, you choose the power that gets it for you. If you want the one with hydraulics, you choose a different power. If you want both, you obtain two different station wagons, and choose which one you want to ride at any given moment. And if you want a station wagon with rims AND hydraulics, you wait until you're level is the appropriate one, and then pick it.

Meanwhile, you can spend feats to improve your Trip abilities, and the feats you spend will improve ALL of your trip abilities, but feats aren't as amazing- they're little things like fuzzy dice for all your station wagons, where powers are big things like low-ride modifications to just one.

This makes power creep MUCH more manageable. It will still happen to a certain degree, because more feats always means more optimization as you combine them to craft exactly what you want, but this change will make a major difference in keeping things under control.

 

[77IM]

Skill Challenges

This short section is almost an entire RPG rule system unto itself.

-- 77IM

 

[Regicide]

Now, milestones are pure gamism, and I didn't like them at first blush, but thinking about them more, i think they provide a perfect tool for combatting the "15 minute adventuring day" -- don't rest and you get more uses of your magic items and more action poinst.

It does nothing of the sort. Resting is still more advantageous than milestones. A party will optimally rest after every fight. The only reason they don't is because encounters are made for PCs to win easily so they don't need to use a daily and an AP every fight. If they did, they'd rest after every fight.

Perveresly the only thing milestones give you that resting doesn't... is recovery from rez. Yes, resting doesn't help, but running around murdering creatures will get you back on your feet. I can't help but think the PCs have their arms thrust forward and moan "braaaaains" as they do it.

I might even be inclined to give an XP bonus for milestones -- maybe 10% for each milestone you have reached since your last rest.

That isn't allowed under 4E as that makes sense. The party being challenged in fights by having less resources at their disposal shouldn't grant more XP as XP isn't based on challenge anymore.

What gamist bits about 4E really turn your crank? Which ones bug you to no end? Are there any elements that looked good/bad on paper but in play turned out to be bad/good?

They got rid of the last half of the book being retardedly broken special rules for a minority of classes, which needed to be done. Massive damage saves are gone which needed to be done. Magic items got toned down, which needed to be done. They really should have stopped there. They did a great job at removing stuff that needed removing, but everything they went and added is gamist and horribly stupid.

Now, I have to get back to making my paladin who slaughters anyone that doesn't worship his god.

 

[GoodKingJayIII]

Let's see...

I like the Powers system. I like that it's a unified mechanic across all the classes, with slight variations amongst each one. I think that probably sticks in a lot of craws, but it's got me more interested in playing a wider variety of classes. In terms of mechanical mastery, the transitioning between various classes is much easier. If I teach someone how to use a Ranger's powers, they won't have such a hard time jumping to a Cleric or Wizard. The tactical options are different, true, but the basic concepts remain.

The simplicity of monster construction. It's a thing of beauty, honestly. Using the DMG monster rules, the transition from concept to concrete is very satisfying.

Those are probably my two favorite mechancical, "gamist" constructions if you will.

 

[Xect]

Perveresly the only thing milestones give you that resting doesn't... is recovery from rez.

That and improved ring usage. And the ability to use action points several encounters in a row without another rest.

While milestones still cant trumph a good nights sleep, they reduce the incentive to rest ridiculously often.