Need help figuring this out...

[Greenfield]

Our D&D 3.5 party ran into a Nightwalker.

The creature seized the Barbarian's +2 Mythral Bastard Swoed of Spell Storing, and tried to crush it.

Here's the hard part: By the book the item needs to make a Fort Save, DC 34.

Items have hardness and hit points (both enhanced by materials like Mythral and by enchantment), but I couldn't find anyplace that tells us how to roll a Fort save for the item.

It's not in its owners possession, so it doesn't use his Saves, and the creature attending it is the one trying to break it.

Is this just a badly written creature ability, or are there rules for item Fort saves that I'm missing?

 

[Dandu]

[h=3]Damaging Magic Items[/h]
A magic item doesn’t need to make a saving throw unless it is unattended, it is specifically targeted by the effect, or its wielder rolls a natural 1 on his save. Magic items should always get a saving throw against spells that might deal damage to them— even against attacks from which a nonmagical item would normally get no chance to save. Magic items use the same saving throw bonus for all saves, no matter what the type (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will). A magic item’s saving throw bonus equals 2 + one-half its caster level (round down). The only exceptions to this are intelligent magic items, which make Will saves based on their own Wisdom scores.
Magic items, unless otherwise noted, take damage as nonmagical items of the same sort. A damaged magic item continues to function, but if it is destroyed, all its magical power is lost.

 

[Greenfield]

I found it.

Hard to find in the books, faster with the SRD, which is searchable.

Unattended magic items have a base Save bonus of 2 + 1/2 caster level.

So to survive the DC 34 Fort save called for by the NightWalker's Sunder ability, a magic sword would need to be made by a Caster Level 28, and roll a natural 20.

Why does that sound wrong?

As for Dandu's contribution: Yes, magic items always get a Save. The question was, how do you calculate its Save bonus.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Magic items use their own save or the wearer's, whichever is higher.

Usually magic items are not affected by an attack unless you roll a natural 1 on a save (so a Fireball could melt your magic sword or burn off your cloak of resistance, if you rolled a natural 1 and then failed a second save for the item) but attacks that specifically target an item (Sunder, nightwalker's crush, etc) bypass this.

The item in question's hit points and hardness are not relevant. The nightwalker simply forces a save, and if it fails, the item "dies" (is destroyed).

 

[Dandu]

As for Dandu's contribution: Yes, magic items always get a Save. The question was, how do you calculate its Save bonus.

[h=5]Caster Level for Weapons[/h]The caster level of a weapon with a special ability is given in the item description. For an item with only an enhancement bonus and no other abilities, the caster level is three times the enhancement bonus. If an item has both an enhancement bonus and a special ability, the higher of the two caster level requirements must be met.

 

[TalenOrAvinair]

Our gaming group ran across this very thing on Tuesday night. Here are the rules:
Saving throw for weapon = 2 + (Total enhancement bonus x 3) + (Special Ability CL x 1/2)

So for my +3 Ghost Touch Morning-star it works out: 2 + (3 x 3) + (9 x 1/2) or 15.

The only hope to save...keep rolling natural 20s

 

[Greenfield]

Okay, his was a +3 Spell Storing blade. Spell Storing requires at least a 12th level caster, so the blade's save bonus would be 2 + ( 3 x 3 ) + 6 = +17

That means it needs to roll a 17 or higher to survive. Good to know it isn't just unstoppable. It's just mostly unstoppable

 

[sheadunne]

I thought that it's an either or situation for caster level. So a +3 spell storing blade would be 2+6=8

Isn't the caster level for a weapon the greater of weapon bonus or special ability, not both?

 

[Nigh Invulnerable]

I ran my party into a Nightwalker once. It destroyed the dervish's double bladed magic swords in a quick smash and he was devastated. It was hilarious.

 

[Arkhandus]

It's either/or. A +1, +2, +3, or +4 weapon of Spell Storing has a caster level of 12 (since Spell Storing has a higher CL than 3x the enhancement bonus in those cases), so it makes saving throws at a total bonus of +8 (2 base and 6 more from one-half caster level). Though a +2 magic weapon has +20 HP and +4 hardness, it doesn't matter against the Nightwalker's supernatural Crush Item ability; those monsters just easily destroy items of Large size or smaller. That's just one part of why Nightwalkers are CR 16 and not generally something you should be fighting up-close with mediocre magic weapons (unless you're good at avoiding disarmament). With their +28 bonus for disarm attempts in 3.5, that can be tough to avoid, but that's why spellcasters get Wall of Force, Wall of Stone, Repulsion, etc. at the middle levels, to keep such nasties from getting too close. Nightwalkers in 3.0 rules only have +20 on disarm attempts and don't have Improved Disarm, so they're easier to fend off (with an AoO or just a good opposed attack roll versus the disarm). A cleric or wizard should ID nightshades with Knowledge (Religion) or Knowledge (The Planes) as soon as they spot them, or else they're not doing part of their job. Really, though, Nightwalkers are made to destroy non-epic/non-artifact magic items at-will whenever they get their hands on 'em in battle.

And disarmament/sundering why you should always carry a spare weapon or two that doesn't suck. And why being a one-trick pony (pure melee damage, no decent ranged attacks or whatever) isn't always effective.